Ep.293 w/ Brian Rothmuller "Being a Sports Card Photographer"

SPEAKER 1: What is up everybody? Welcome to episode 193 of Sports Cardin Nation podcast. Happy to talk to my guest on today's program.

SPEAKER 1: You might remember about a year and a half ago, two years ago, we had Nick Wasak on a Sports Card photographer who does a, a lot of work for upper deck. Today, we're gonna have Brian Roth Mueller on and he's also a sports car photographer. Different part of the country does mostly baseball, not just baseball but heavy baseball and heavy tops.

SPEAKER 1: And a lot of his work appears on our favorite tops cards including S SPS and short prints and inserts and parallels. And it's important work that they do. You know, when we open packs and get the cards. We love. I, I'm, I do it myself. I'm not criticizing anyone else.

SPEAKER 1: I'm throwing myself kind of under the same bus I think we take for granted the work that goes into getting these shots and, you know, we think these guys just show up at the game, you know, for an hour, take some shots, go home, you know, send some picks and, and they're done. It's, it'd be nice for them if it was that easy. But we know from talking to Nick and we'll know from talking to Brian.

SPEAKER 1: Not so fast. My friend, right. A lot more difficult than that. These guys are grinding and they're not guaranteed a paycheck. It's based on, you know what, you know, someone uses, they get paid for their work as it's used. And so you gotta be good at what you do as well. So there's a little pressure there.

SPEAKER 1: And II, I love the behind the scenes and we got that with Nick and we're gonna get it even more today with, with Brian. So really excited, for today's conversation. Speaking of excitement, if you're listening to this on Show Release Day, we are just a few days away from the national in Cleveland, Ohio, my first time, in Cleveland.

SPEAKER 1: A for any reason, got a whole itinerary set for the week, going to the rock and roll hall, the Guardian's Game.

SPEAKER 1: Other things, obviously, the Diamond King, movie screening and, just a full week of events. I'll be walking the floor. Hope to meet a lot of you again. Hope to meet a lot of you again for the first time. If you see me, I am a, a personal guy. I won't bite your head off. Come over, shake your hand. Talk about life, talk about sports, talk about hobby, like to meet as many, as we can.

SPEAKER 1: Also have card bench cards signed by myself and Danny Black grab one of those as well. We'll have those on our person. So if you see us mention it and get one of those as well, so, enough ra and let's get a quick 32nd commercial break and we're gonna talk with sports photographer, Brian Roth Mueller.

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SPEAKER 1: Excited to have the next guest on the Sports Card shop guest line. He is a hobbyist collector and he also takes some of the photo photos. We're all so fond of seeing on our cardboard and chrome. Welcome Brian Roth Mauller to the show.

SPEAKER 3: Thanks. Thanks for having me.

SPEAKER 1: Well, Brian, I've, I've had, you know, car photographer on before. Very obviously, very important to hobbyists, right? Without your work, we wouldn't get to enjoy, the cards as, as we do. But you're also, a collector yourself. Talk a little bit about kind of your hobby. Start what you collect. And, and what moves your meter, so to speak. Sure.

SPEAKER 3: So I started collecting, in the early eighties when I was a little kid.

SPEAKER 3: The first sort of set that I remember was 82 tops.

SPEAKER 3: That was sort of my intro. I don't remember opening too many packs, but I remember, like, looking through those cards and anytime I see that design, it definitely like brings back a lot of memories.

SPEAKER 3: 82 tops and then 82 donors. I remember getting packs and opening those and, and it just sort of took off from then and collected through my, through my teens and, you know, like everyone else, once I got to college, it kind of slowed down and I was always aware of them, like, you know, if I was at the store or Target or something, I would look at them and see sort of what was out there.

SPEAKER 3: But, didn't really get back into collecting until, I saw some of my pictures on cards and then, wanted to, wanted to make sure I had some of those and then, just sort of got back deep into it. And yeah, anytime a new release comes out, it's like Christmas for me because I get to get to see if any of my photos made the cards. And it's it's been a lot of fun.

SPEAKER 1: So what do you like, personally collect? Do you have a player? A team?

SPEAKER 3: I, I just basically collect any, any cards that feature my photos. So, I'll pick up, you know, some other stuff here and there, but mostly it's, it's anything that has my photos on it.

SPEAKER 3: So, I definitely like the ones that feature, you know, the throwback designs from the eighties because those, those have, you know, place in my heart if you would have told, you know, 10 year old me that I'd have photos on cards that I was looking at at that point, that probably would have just blown my mind. So, definitely gravitate towards those and obviously, you know, it's so much being so expensive these days.

SPEAKER 3: I can't get everything that, that has my, my photos on it. But yeah, just mainly mainly picking up those and sort of tracking what is coming out and, and when it's coming out and definitely spend a lot of time on ebay just looking at you know, other people's photos that have gotten on cards and, and what tops and Panini like to use.

SPEAKER 3: And I spent a lot of time during COVID doing that and I, I feel like it really helped sort of what my eye was looking for when I was when I'm working. So, and definitely has exploded the amount of amount of my photos that have been on cards since then.

SPEAKER 1: So you mentioned even as a kid, you know, looking at the cards and, and the, and the photos what and, and to think like you said, you know, all these years later, you'll be directly involved in, into this whole process, you know, when did you really, you know, when did that be an aspiration or how, how did it all kind of me when I was little?

SPEAKER 3: I never thought that you could do that like as a job. I, you know, it was just like, ok, no one, no one grows up and takes pictures for, for for cards. But I would, I would always be, you know, interested in, in the cards that had, you know, really cool action shots.

SPEAKER 3: I remember the, the 82 tops, they had the inaction cards which were, I remember I had This Carlton Fisk one that was horizontal and I just thought it was so cool how he was like, I think he's diving for the diving for the ball or, or stretched out.

SPEAKER 3: And it's funny, my mom actually moved from our house that she lived in for 30 years last last year and I was up there looking at stuff and I found like cards that I had created like when I was a kid just with pictures and designs. And so I definitely had that creative itch, I guess at that age.

SPEAKER 3: And when I got out of college I worked in advertising, for a long time and then, had some health things that I needed to step away and, was just sort of doing photography part time and then it just blew into a full time gig. So, just sort of kind of lucked into it and then, took off once, once I started doing it full time.

SPEAKER 1: So, yeah, I mentioned to you before we started recording, you know, Nick was, has been on the show. He does a lot of stuff with upper deck and, and in hockey. You do a pretty much, tops Panini. I mean, what talk about where we might find some of your work as far as on the cardboard. You know, people open the packs, where might your photography be, illustrated.

SPEAKER 3: So I would say probably 80% of my stuff is like I was on baseball just cause I shoot so much of it.

SPEAKER 3: Then, you know, another percentage is golf.

SPEAKER 3: You know, upper deck has brought back golf the last last four years or so.

SPEAKER 3: So it was exciting to see some of my pictures of Tiger on cards.

SPEAKER 3: That was another, wow moment for me. See seeing that and, I don't shoot a ton of hockey. I've had some hockey cards, but I'm not like Nick where that's like his passion and, didn't really grow up with, in the Bay Area. By the time I was sort of moving out of there, the Sharks had come in and so I didn't really grow up with hockey. Hockey is a really hard sport to shoot.

SPEAKER 3: You know, the people who shoot it, have that have that eye and have that talent and, you know, they're really good at it. So, so I'd say golf, football, basketball, a lot of the, a lot of the college stuff that's coming out now, with, with Bowman U, I shoot a ton of college basketball, ton of college football.

SPEAKER 3: So, a lot of my pitchers are Caleb willing that I shot, were on cards and, shot a bunch of brawny this year. So, yeah, it's just, it's a wide variety, I would say, mainly baseball, but I, I do shoot, I do shoot a lot of other sports as well.

SPEAKER 1: So how competitive of, of an industry is, is sports, and Sports Card photography. It is, it generally AAA fraternity where most people get along and kind of help each other out or can it be competitive or it really depends on the, on the individual.

SPEAKER 3: So, it's interesting because like when I grew up in the eighties, they, each of these, each of these companies had their own photographers that they had full time. Traveling and shooting games and, that's just not the way it is anymore.

SPEAKER 3: It just doesn't make any sense for them to do that financially. And I'm not sure exactly when that stopped. But, for baseball, baseball buys all their photos from Getty images, which is a wire service.

SPEAKER 3: So anyone who shoots for Getty, or shoots for another company that publishes their photos on Getty, that, that's the, that's the stockpile that tops goes through to, to grab their photos.

SPEAKER 3: So you'll see a lot of people, they'll post a picture and they'll be like, oh, why isn't this on a card? Well, if it, if it's not a Getty photo, it's, it's not gonna make it on a card. So, in terms of competition, I mean, there's a, there's a handful of us who are like card guys.

SPEAKER 3: You mentioned Nick, there's, there's a guy in Colorado, there's a couple of guys in New York and, you know, they love seeing their, their photos on cards, they know what kind of photos go on cards.

SPEAKER 3: In LA. I mean, I feel like I'm sort of the only person who's kind of doing that.

SPEAKER 3: You know, there's great photographers here but they're, they're focused on, you know, getting their, their, their photos in the newspapers and magazines and, and all those and, and online and, and I'm kind of shooting in a different, different way in terms of, you know, shooting a lot of, sort of behind the scenes, stuff like in the dugout where I'm, you know, trying to get image variation shots and, and, shooting, you know, a lot of, of batting stances and, you know, just, just knowing what the different sets are and the different pictures that they're looking for.

SPEAKER 3: So I don't think, I mean, if you, if you ask the guys who are sort of car guy photographers, they're, they're doing it that way and they're successful because of that. And it's not to say that, you know, other photographers who shoot forgetting, don't get cards.

SPEAKER 3: It's, it's just, you know, we have a slight advantage of, of knowing a little bit about the industry and a little bit about what they're looking for. And, I'm more excited when my, when my photos get on cards than if it goes online or gets in a magazine or, or anything like that.

SPEAKER 3: So I, I would say we're a, we're a rare breed.

SPEAKER 3: But we definitely bond together and, you know, share things that we see and it, it's a fun, little fun little group.

SPEAKER 1: We have no doubt, kind of a two pronged question, Brian too.

SPEAKER 1: Do you think being a, of a collector yourself gives you an advantage as a photographer? I think you touched a little bit on that. And what percentage of sports photographer, obviously you collect? I know Nick does as well.

SPEAKER 1: But what overall, what percent do you think the majority probably don't in the grand scheme of things. So two prong there, you know, does collecting give you an advantage as a photographer? And what percentage of the industry are collectors like yourself? Would you say?

SPEAKER 3: I would say it's a small percentage.

SPEAKER 3: But I feel like more people are sort of coming out of the woodworks lately and, and posting, you know, oh, hey, I got a photo on a card and, it's sort of become cool again, I guess maybe, or, but I would say it's a small percentage, in terms of having an advantage to, I mean, it's like, you know, exactly what they're looking for.

SPEAKER 3: And, it has become a challenge now that sort of tops has, has gotten, moved into fanatics. They've sort of changed how they, use photos on their cards. E especially in their flagship brand. They for a while, they just use sort of any photos. It was home away, whatever uniform. And about two years ago, they started almost using exclusively home uniforms on all the flagship cards. So that, that cuts into my sales a little bit.

SPEAKER 3: I mean, I am lucky. I live in L A and I get to shoot Dodgers and Angels.

SPEAKER 3: I don't know if I'd say lucky to shoot the Angels this year. But, but yeah, just knowing that and, you know, some of the other brands they don't really, or, products, they don't really care if it's a home or, or a way Jersey.

SPEAKER 3: But that's, that's one thing I noticed and, yeah, just knowing what shots they like and what shots they use, you know, a lot of people don't shoot bad practice, other photographers unless it's like, you know, a big team coming in, like the Yankees or something like that.

SPEAKER 3: And I'm normally out there, you know, every, every batting practice trying to get, you know, one or two sort of fun shots that, you know, could appear on a, like a, you know, an SSP or an image variation card.

SPEAKER 3: And, so I'm looking for that and the other photographers, they're definitely not looking for that, you know, they're, they're looking for something else. So, so that gives me an advantage and, you know, sometimes I'll be out there for an hour and not get anything at all and, and sometimes they'll be out there for an hour and, you know, get a bunch of stuff.

SPEAKER 3: So it's just sort of luck of the draw, you know, the players might be in a good mood that day or they might not be in a good mood that day and, and some of the bigger players, they don't, they don't even come out for batting practice anymore.

SPEAKER 3: They just hit, you know, underneath the, the dugout and the tunnels. So, so, yeah, I mean, I, I'm, I'm trying to get stuff that, that I've seen on cards or would like to on cards.

SPEAKER 3: And, you know, they're definitely been pushing a little more cooler images, I guess, a little more variety images. Especially with all the image variations. I mean, it's kind of overkill with having an image variation for every card.

SPEAKER 3: But there, there have been some cool ones that probably wouldn't have, wouldn't have existed if they just, you know, sort of stuck with what they were doing in, in the past. So, yeah, for me it's always, it's always finding the cool thoughts that show up on, you know, Stadium Club or, or an image variation those that get the, the biggest kick out of.

SPEAKER 1: So, yeah, I like, I like the, you know, I'll use an analogy, like you said, you could be out there an hour and, and not maybe get a great shot available to you for another hour where you got multiple. It's almost, it almost sounds like fishing. You feel you in the water and you, you know, you have a good hour or you, you, you know, no one's no one's biting a worm for, for an hour.

SPEAKER 4: Time for a quick break. But we'll be right back.

SPEAKER 5: For nearly 50 years. Sports collectors Digest has been the voice of the hobby, bringing you comprehensive coverage of the sports collectible industry. From industry news, auction results, market analysis and in depth stories about collectors and their collections. Sports collectors digest has everything you need to know about the hobby.

SPEAKER 5: S CD also your leading source for listings of sports collectible dealers, card shops, card shows and the latest from the industry's top companies to check out all the latest news or to subscribe to the hobby's oldest magazine. Visit sports collectors, digest.com or call 1 808 29 55 61.

SPEAKER 4: Thanks for sticking with us. Let's return to the show.

SPEAKER 1: You mentioned the Stadium Club, one of my favorite brands for exactly by the reason, you know, what, what you do that some of the greatest photography is, is in that brand, you know, you mentioned, is, do you like Stadium Club for the same reason, as a photographer because you get some of that different shots in the stand alone, you know, close facial shot or just a guy standing in the batter's box or, or that sort of thing.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah, I think I, I mean, when I was growing up Stadium Club was like, you know, the first like premium brand too. So it was like, oh wow, I got a pack of Stadium Club. That's amazing. And, and I remember, you know, they had the big like Kodak logo on the front of the package and, and the, the pack and, you know, it was, it was this premium sort of photo driven site.

SPEAKER 3: So, so I've always been, been drawn to it. I always like looking at, you know, what, what photos they choose for specific cards and, you know, it gives me ideas for, for what I might go out and shoot for the next year. And, yeah, it's, it's definitely, it's definitely a favorite site.

SPEAKER 3: I mean, a favorite, favorite, set. And, yeah, I do like, do like seeing it every time it comes out. So it's, it's, it's interesting though because I'll see some, some photos and they be like, oh, you know, they couldn't find a better photo than that and then there will be some that are just great that you're just like, wow.

SPEAKER 3: They really, they really hit it on this one. So it's a fun set, fun set.

SPEAKER 1: Yeah, it just kind of separates itself to me from the flagship. You got the glossiness, some of the different shots you're not getting in some of the other, releases. Like you mentioned, you mentioned tops has really went to, home uniforms.

SPEAKER 1: Do you, do you know why that is? Or do you have a theory?

SPEAKER 3: What, what that, I mean, my theory is just like, you know, if you're a fan of the team, you want to see them in the home, the home uniform. So, like if you're a Yankees fan, you want to see judge in this, in the Pinstripes, you don't want to see him in the, in the gray. So I'm sure it's just, you know, a, a brand manager or a creative person, just sort of said this is probably what the fans would like to see.

SPEAKER 3: So that's sort of how I took it.

SPEAKER 3: But I, I haven't heard anything, anything directly but I've definitely noticed that that's, you know, if you look at the, the flagship cards, they're almost all home home cards unless it's a player that was either called up late in the season where he doesn't have a ton of ton of photos in his home Jersey or got hurt early in the season or something like that.

SPEAKER 3: But most of them are all, are all home home jerseys. So even the, so for, for series two, they did a lot of, a lot of photoshopping of o tani cards and solo cards and, you know, all the players that switch teams and they're pretty much all photoshopped into, into the white Jersey as well. So, even taking a, a road Jersey of Otani and turning it into a white Jersey at the doctors.

SPEAKER 1: So, yeah, the, the other question you mentioned tops really utilizes like Getty images almost exclusively. Again, I'll, I'll, I'll acquiesce to your expertise. I I would think it would make more econo economical sense. Brian, for them to, to use the photographers directly. I mean, Getty's Getty's not out cheap, I've seen sometimes to use an image.

SPEAKER 1: Why do you think again, you know, theory wise, why do you think tops, does that rather than just hire a photographer or, or a photographer pool? Why do you think? To me it seems like that would be the more expensive route. Now, phonetics, fanatics is not short of money. But you think you'd wanna save where you could as well?

SPEAKER 3: Yeah, they buy so much. They buy so many images that they get such a discount on them. So, it, it definitely saves them money doing, doing the get and then they have just a bigger pool of images to choose from too.

SPEAKER 3: You know, you hire one photographer to shoot, you know, say one Dodgers game in a week, maybe some of the players don't play or they go for four and you don't get anything, at least, at least this way, you know, there's a Getty photographer at every game.

SPEAKER 3: So you have, have all the shots covered and, I think financially it's, it's cheaper on them to, to just buy them off of, off the site based on just the quantity that they buy, they get such a discount at it. So, yeah, that's, that's what I'd say about that.

SPEAKER 1: Ok. Yeah, I didn't, I didn't really think about that aspect and the amount they're probably, acquire and it, they're, they're getting sort of that, quantity discount. If you will, do you stay with? What, what you shoot? Do you stay pretty much on the west coast? How far do you get to travel for?

SPEAKER 3: Yeah, I don't travel too much. Mainly west coast.

SPEAKER 3: When my mom lived up in the Bay Area, I would go up there quite a bit to shoot, you know, either a Niners game or some Giants games.

SPEAKER 3: But, but living in LA, I mean, there's plenty to, to keep me busy with, with 22 baseball teams. I mean, there's San Diego too, which is, which is close by. So, I'm never short of, events to work.

SPEAKER 3: So, there's definitely, there's definitely plenty out here and, you know, when the, it wa it was, it was a bigger advantage when, before the MLB started this new schedule where everyone sort of played everyone because, you know, I would have American League team and a national league team here.

SPEAKER 3: So I would sort of get everyone, but now with everybody sort of playing, playing more teams, it, it, that advantage sort of, sort of went away.

SPEAKER 3: But, but, yeah, I mean, I'm, I'm covered, covered here plenty with, you know, two NFL teams and two NBA teams and two base teams and, and hockey teams. And so I'm in a good spot. Plus the teams are good except for the Angels right now. But, yeah, that's a whole another whole, another, story probably.

SPEAKER 1: Yeah. And I, I know your schedule probably very, but in an average, you know, seven day week, how many days are you shooting? Would you, would you say?

SPEAKER 3: It just depends. I mean, it normally works out where if the Dodgers are here, the Angels are on the road.

SPEAKER 3: There's very rare cases where they're both at home that's only for like a couple days.

SPEAKER 3: So right now the Dodgers are about to go on the road. So I'm shooting Angels tonight and then I think I have another game on, Thursday Angels game. So I shoot less Angels games than I shoot Dodgers games.

SPEAKER 3: Just based on the players and with Trout hurt right now, it's, it's sort of slim pickings. I have, I have the A's tonight against the Angels and then the Tigers versus the Angels. So, yeah, those, those will probably be, some games that will be a little, not as good as good as some of the other games. But, yeah, for a Dodgers series, normally I'm shooting like, maybe two out of the three games, that they're playing.

SPEAKER 3: I have, I have the biggest though. Tommy K right now, I haven't, been to one game this season that he's hit a home run.

SPEAKER 3: I didn't, I didn't work at all last week. I mean, he doesn't watch it so he, he hit a home run at every game pretty much that I haven't been, it's like a running joke now.

SPEAKER 3: It's like, just if he knew, like, he was batting like 200 when I went to the games, he probably would just pay me not to show up. But, yeah, it's bad right now. I haven't, I, I haven't gotten a home run last year. I had the, I was at the game where he blew out his elbow.

SPEAKER 3: So, yeah, he probably doesn't want any part of me.

SPEAKER 1: So you're the guy? No, I'm just kidding.

SPEAKER 3: It's all, it's all my fault. So, but, yeah, it's, it's been weird like this year. I think I shot like five of almost all of Yamamoto's home starts, including the one he got hurt at.

SPEAKER 3: And so my luck was good with that. But, yeah, Tony, I don't know, it's just a lot of walks, a lot of singles. He's still on a ton of bases, but, I mean, you can only get so many photos of that.

SPEAKER 3: And then I see these beautiful pictures of him staring at these long home runs that he's sitting well, you know, I'm at home, not working and, just sort of laugh now.

SPEAKER 1: So now Brian, do you, do you set your own schedule or do you, are you like, it's a combination?

SPEAKER 3: Yeah.

SPEAKER 3: I can set some of it. Some of it just depends, you know, we have a couple of photographers here. So, you know, we balance it out.

SPEAKER 3: I can set it more with the Dodgers than, than the Angels. There's another guy who shoots the Angels who's been shooting them for years. He used to be the team photographer. So, he sort of gets first crack. I get second crack but, sort of get first crack at the doctors. And, yeah, I try to balance it out. I mean, I, I do have a two year old at home. So it's, it's hard when I, when I get home late or not home for dinner.

SPEAKER 3: So, it's definitely been sort of a balance and try in time to try to figure out you know, how often I work and, and the cadence of that and I think I sort of settled down to settle down to a good cadence. But you know, when I'm not working, I have, I have images that I need to edit. So normally the game, it's, you know, 3030 or so images go up either during or after the game of the game.

SPEAKER 3: And then I'll post maybe up to 100 more in the coming coming days after that. So, yeah, I shoot probably 2000 images a game. So, you know, I have to go through all those after and, and there's always, there's always work to be done. I always sort of get behind in my editing, especially when I work a bunch of games in a row. It just sort of, piles up. So, even when I'm not at a game, there's, there's definitely work to be done.

SPEAKER 1: So I'm glad you mentioned that Brian, you know, every people who don't realize or, or don't really think about things, think like, hey, this guy's got the great, and you have a great job. I, I think you agree.

SPEAKER 1: But like, he just gets to take pictures and then he, he's done, they don't realize the stuff that goes on behind be behind the scenes, the editing. Hey, I like this shot now that, you know, this didn't turn out the way I, I hope so. You delete that or they don't realize the work.

SPEAKER 1: It's not just going to a game, taking a bunch of pictures and you're done. Maybe to someone who doesn't know that's what they think. I realized that just from, you know, being in the industry, talking with Nick Pryor and, and stuff, there's, there's, there's work that goes into it.

SPEAKER 1: The other misconception and I'll let you touch on this too is like, oh, you get to watch, you know, sports for free, you know, but you're working like, you can't really get caught up in, in the moment because you never know when that next shot's gonna, you know, be so kind of talk about that is like you're at the game but you're, you're at the game in a different perspective than your average fan.

SPEAKER 1: But maybe it's a combi combination of both.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah, I mean, there's definitely, there's definitely photographers out out here that, you know, shoot for various publications and they're sort of there to shoot, but also just to be seen and sort of be at the game. And, that's, that's just sort of not how I see it at all. I mean, the minute you're get wrapped up in a game is the minute you miss, you miss a shot.

SPEAKER 3: Especially right now it's like sort of the dog days of summer. I've shot so many games already this year that, everything starts to look the same out of my camera.

SPEAKER 3: And it becomes a challenge at a boring game to keep focused. And, there was an Angels game a couple weeks ago where, you know, my mind was going and, and, wasn't totally totally focused in the game and I, I missed like, three shots and I was just like, ok, I need to like, you know, keep it together because everyone around me was sort of doing the same thing too.

SPEAKER 3: It was like, you know, everyone was just kind of talking and, you know, it was a blowout well then, but, you know, I missed a shot that could have, that could have made me money. So, you know, I need to be, need to be focused.

SPEAKER 3: The second you become a fan is the second you just, you just miss everything. You get wrapped up in it and, it's, it's, it's not good. So, I mean, a lot of people when I tell them what I do, they go, oh, that's so cool. You gotta, you know, you could be in, dug out and do this and, oh, do you talk to players and blah, blah, blah and like, ok, it's, it's totally not like that.

SPEAKER 3: Like, you know, if a player says something to me then sure I'll engage. But like, it's a profe like they're there to do their job and we're here to do our job, like, and, you know, it's not really professional to just start talking to someone and, and, you know, they're not there to talk to you.

SPEAKER 3: They're, they're there to, to, to play a game. So, you know, occasionally, you know, a player will, will ask to see a pitch or something that I took a picture of, the Kansas City Royals, Sal Perez, in the dugout before the game. And, it's like maybe an hour 45 minutes before the game.

SPEAKER 3: And he was, he was about to go out to the bullpen to warrant the catcher and he is one of the players that blow the best bubbles of any players in, in the major leagues. Like it as a, as a photographer. I love big bubbles. I love, I black, I love sunglasses, like anything that just like, you know, brings something else to the photo besides, you know, just, you know, the normal, the normal stuff.

SPEAKER 3: So he was blowing bubbles in the dugout. He was just sitting in there and I was taking some pictures and he blew this huge one and, and, I took a picture of it and he, he laughed and he's like, that was a good, that was a good bubble.

SPEAKER 3: So I showed it to him and, you know, that that sort of interaction is very rare so early. Like the game hadn't started, there was no one else around, like, and we're sort of having, having a moment like he knew I was taking pictures. He was OK with it.

SPEAKER 3: Some of the players, like, you know, you stick a camera towards their, you know, in their direction before the game, you can just tell they, they, they don't, they don't want it. Like you just sort of just, you know, you're not gonna get a good pitcher out of it and you're just gonna annoy them. So, you know, there's, there's a fine line between, between doing that and not doing it.

SPEAKER 1: Some awesome insights from Brian Roth Mueller right there. If you enjoyed it as much as I did. Don't fret part two next Friday as well. So this was the first part of our two part conversation with Brian. So, come back, next Friday and see, the conclusion, of our hobby and Sports Card, photography, conversation.

SPEAKER 4: Time for our hobby is the people announcer of the week.

SPEAKER 6: Hello, this is Mark Hoyle. And remember the hobby is the people.

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SPEAKER 7: That's a wrap for this week. Huge thanks to you, the listeners out there because without you, there is no ice.

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SPEAKER 7: I'll leave you with this.

SPEAKER 7: How do we change the world? One random act of kindness at a time.

SPEAKER 7: Remember the hobby is the people.

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