Ep.248 w/ Theo/ClementeCollector "Hobbying his way"

SPEAKER 1: This is Sports Card Nation.

SPEAKER 2: What is up everybody? Episode 2 48 of the show known as Sports Guard Nation. Glad as always to be back. Got a great guest. Today I met him in person for the first time, some weeks back at the National, his first National. But, we're gonna talk about that show. We're gonna talk about his show as in YouTube and a new show, a new channel.

SPEAKER 2: He's, he's gonna be doing, a network as well. So, Theo Clemente Collector, as the name implies, collects Clemente, we learn all about that. What he collects, why, how he goes about it, some grading, on the table for discussion as well. Great, great and fun conversation.

SPEAKER 2: We had, kind of just picking up sort of where we left off at the National, in person. And, you know, made plans there. I said, hey, gotta to have you on the show and, today's that day. So, you know, one other shameless plug, we're getting a little more active on YouTube ourselves. That's, Theo's, wheelhouse. But, we're trying to be a little more active.

SPEAKER 2: We appreciate it if you check out, some of our stuff on Sports Car Nation podcast on YouTube, there is stuff there that you won't hear in podcast form, as well. So, like, and subscribe, we would really appreciate that. But, this guy knows YouTube, better than me. And, so let's, let's get to that as soon as we can.

SPEAKER 1: Time for our hobby is the people announcer of the week.

SPEAKER 1: This is Andy Friedman. Remember the hobby is the people if you'd like to be the hobby is the people announcer of the week. Do a wave or MP3 file and send it to Sports Card Nation PC at gmail dot com.

SPEAKER 3: Hobby News Daily is your home page of the hobby, providing original writing, exclusive gem rate data, a daily morning minute podcast and some of the best content creators in the hobby. Remember Hobby News Daily dot com. And at Hobby News Daily on social Happy Collecting.

SPEAKER 4: Hi. This is Pat Hughes Cubs announcer. Coming to you from the sports card shop in beautiful New Buffalo, Michigan. The Gocher family has built an incredible place here for collectors to buy, sell and trade cards and memorabilia. Be sure to stop by and let them show you around the sports card shop dot com. Connecting sportss athletes, the hobby and collectors around the world.

SPEAKER 5: Hi, this is Alan Pinkett and I'm here to tell you the Gocher family has done it again.

SPEAKER 5: They've just opened up the sport card shop in downtown Valparaiso, Indiana. And it is awesome.

SPEAKER 5: If you're a collector, you need to check this place out.

SPEAKER 5: Tell them Allen sent you and get a free gift on your first visit.

SPEAKER 2: I'm real excited to talk to my next guest on the sports card chat, guest line. I got to chat with him a little bit in person, about a month ago, at the National in Chicago.

SPEAKER 2: I've seen his YouTube productions as well and he's a great guy and we're gonna talk a little, a lot about what he does, what he collects and, and what's coming up the turnpike and, but without further ado, let's bring him on the Clemente Collector from, from you to welcome.

SPEAKER 6: Thanks for having me, John. It's, it's honestly an honor for the, the people who sat in my seat on the show. I, I'm honored you asked me to come on and I, I enjoyed meeting you at the National.

SPEAKER 2: Well, like I said, the, you know, the tagline of the show, it's on the screen for those that are, are seeing this on, on, on video, the hobbies, the people, right? All of us, I don't care what title you wear, how big of a title, how not big of a title.

SPEAKER 2: It might be, we all put our pants on as far as I know one leg at a time, we all, we're all in this fraternity called the hobby. We all have the passion, for the cards and, and players. We collect and, you epitomize that one thing. I, you know, I, I love about you when I grab it to Tate, towards, you know, genuine people, honest people.

SPEAKER 2: And I think he checked those boxes the, and, and that's why we're, that's why we're, we're, we're talking, to today. So, I mean, let's get right into kinda, it's, you know, it's the standard boring sort of podcast question.

SPEAKER 2: But, and some people may know the answer because you've talked about it before. But for those that don't know you or listening for the first time to you, you know, kind of how you got into the hobby and then even pass that like, Clemente was, which is, you know, someone you collect and you, and you're fed up.

SPEAKER 6: Yeah. Sure.

SPEAKER 6: So I, I'm a, a Western Pennsylvania boy.

SPEAKER 6: Family was all coal miners, you know, grew up in a patch town.

SPEAKER 6: All those kind of stereotypes that go with western Pennsylvania.

SPEAKER 6: And I, I grew up in my, my grandpa used to take me to the local flea market that was the only place you could get singles. And, and my big passion was collecting Pittsburgh Pirates cards. And, you know, that that was always something special to me that we did together. And, and, you know, one of the biggest cards that he bought me was a Barry Bonds rookie card.

SPEAKER 6: And, and I still have it to this day. But, but as I got older I continued to just collect, Pittsburgh Steelers cards, Penguins, cards, Pirates cards. And that was their, the junk wax era. I'm a nineties kid. And, you know, like, like a lot of us out there, I get to college and, and I start collecting and then 2020 hit and I hear that sports cards are coming back and I wanted to be a part of it.

SPEAKER 6: So I started watching YouTube videos and the, the videos that kept popping on my feet were break videos and I i it was all football related. People were, you know, picking a team on ebay and, and getting them the breaks and, and I started watching those and then I started finally getting to collectors channels and, and, so this, this takes, this takes on for about four months.

SPEAKER 6: I'm just watching YouTube not buying anything and, and I go over to my parents' house for dinner and I tell my parents I wanna get my old cards and I wanna look through them. I bet you I have a bunch of cards worth a bunch of money, which was 100% not true.

SPEAKER 6: I literally had nothing worth nothing. So, but, but you know, I was just new back in, didn't really know much about the junk wax like that. I lived through the junk wax era. It didn't, you know, when you were living through it, you didn't realize there were at least me as a kid. I didn't realize it was that much printed.

SPEAKER 6: So, so I told my parents.

SPEAKER 2: That I'm not to cut you off.

SPEAKER 2: I'm older than you. And I actually had a card store during the trunk wax era. So I knew every bit of what was going on. Unfortunately, or fortunately depending on the situation. But, but yeah, I, I had to throw that in there, but go ahead.

SPEAKER 6: Yeah. Yeah. So you were the guy taking advantage of us kids?

SPEAKER 2: Not all the time, not all the time.

SPEAKER 6: So, so I tell my dad what my plan is that I'm gonna go look up through my cards and he, he, he drops a bombshell on me. He tells me he still has his cards from childhood and that, that he actually had a like everybody else. He had a whole bunch of cards. His mom threw away a majority of them, but he kept the 1961 1960 1962 tops cards he had.

SPEAKER 6: And I was shocked a lot of people don't, don't really believe that part of the story because it sounds crazy. But my dad has like an, an army trunk that he just had from when he was in the military. He put him in there. He never brought up that he had these, I don't know if he didn't trust me or what. But he, he pulls out 33 old, junk wax or not junk wax.

SPEAKER 6: He pulled out three old tops boxes. They were all dated in 1962 original cardboard boxes and he literally has them in stacks of like 50 he has rubber bands wrapped around him and the rubber bands are all dry, rotted. So like the front card, like I was literally picking rubber band pieces off of it with my fingernail in the back card also.

SPEAKER 6: So, so we sit down at the kitchen table and we start unloading all these cards. I, I still don't know much about vintage As a as a child, the furthest I went back was looking at 1986 cards. So I really didn't know exactly, you know, did we hit a gold mine here? What am I like looking at here?

SPEAKER 6: So we organize the cards and he's got, he's got a complete 1962 top set, the wood grain background if anybody out there is listening. So he's got the complete from one, from card one all the way to the end. No duplicates. He's got about half the 1960 set and half the, the 1961. Set and, and once again, none of those cards are duplicates.

SPEAKER 6: So what I asked him is I said, can I take these cards home and like, look these? And he said, yeah, sure, go ahead.

SPEAKER 6: So I took him home and I started going deep diving on ebay, YouTube and that's where I started learning about those errors of baseball cards. And, and one of the first youtubers I watched was actually Blue Rock TV. I I was interested in, in what I had with the Clemente cards my dad had and I and Blue Rock TV actually had a countdown of his favorite Clemente cards.

SPEAKER 6: So, so that's kind of where I started going down the rabbit hole of vintage on, on YouTube. And, and basically after that, I went back to my dad and I told him, you know, you have three Mickey Mantle cards they're worth. And of course, at the time, you don't realize how harsh grace grading is.

SPEAKER 6: I'm like, this car is worth like 30,000. This car is worth like 10,000 have no, like I like, literally like, that's one of the biggest pitfalls too, of somebody who doesn't do enough research is they assume it's either like like a PS A eight or PS A 10. They look at that pricing.

SPEAKER 6: So I'm like, I'm like, we just hit the jackpot and, and basically what he says to me is he says Well, why don't you just sell all those cards? You know, I'm not getting any younger. So, so I actually ii I literally went through the process of getting them all graded and selling them all.

SPEAKER 6: What my dad didn't know though is I never sold any of the Pirates cards. And, so that, that, that process of me processing the cards, selling the cards grading the cards helped me do more research and find more love for vintage. And the biggest card he ended up having after I sold everything but the Pirates cards is he had a 1961 Mickey Mantle card and PS A graded it as six.

SPEAKER 6: We ended up it ended up going on ebay for about $1000. So so basically, let me show you first off, let me show you this. This is the 19 sixties Clemente card from his collection. It got an SGC four and it's got great centering on it. I couldn't I couldn't ask for.

SPEAKER 2: I will say this 1960 D is one of my favorite years of, of cards. I don't know what it is. A lot of the, the, you know, the the sideways cards, the dual photo, just the designs that they're colorful. They kinda, they pop.

SPEAKER 2: I love the 1960 top set but, but go ahead.

SPEAKER 6: Yeah, so, so so three, I got three Clementes from his cars I got the 60 61 62 from him.

SPEAKER 6: They, they graded a four, a four and a 4.5. So, so like I said, they were, they were in decent conditions for being rubber banded together. So what happened next was I, I went to his house with a big stack of cash and I really felt good about myself. You know, I was a little bit sad about the cards that we let go and especially the Mickey Mantle.

SPEAKER 6: The one card I really loved was there was the the maze Mickey Mantle 1962 card. The man I think it's the manager's dream card, right? And yeah, and that got a 4.5 and you know, in the back of my head, I was like, dang, I wish I had that card after I, after I learned more about like all the players and stuff like that. And I took the stack of cash to his house and I felt really good about myself.

SPEAKER 6: He counts it out and he's like, wow, you did better than I thought. And then he's like, I just take the money back. I I you were gonna have these cards anyway, just keep the money. And so, so I was in one way, I was really thankful obviously. But in another way, I, if I knew that was the plan in the first place, I probably would have win it with a different strategy of how I did it.

SPEAKER 2: That's funny.

SPEAKER 2: Yeah. Did, did. And obviously it, like you said, you learned in the process on the fly. Sometimes the, that's the best way to learn is hands on. Sometimes you take it on the chin occasionally, right? Trial and error.

SPEAKER 2: But it's also how you learn what to do or what not to do. Did, did the, did, did, did, did it rekindle anything in your dad? As far as collecting or not, not really at, at this stage of his life, he's probably just like I'Ll, I'Ll let you enjoy it.

SPEAKER 6: Yeah, I mean, as, as I, as I went down the road and got more Clemente cards, he's been along the way to see them all and look at them, but he's not, he doesn't pick up any card and go.

SPEAKER 6: I remember this one like he will tell me stories though about going to the, going to Forbes field and, and the players themselves, which is very meaningful to me because I want to hear those stories. So it's more of, it's more of passing down the memories he had of the players than the actual card collecting of it.

SPEAKER 2: Yeah. And that, and that's cool and, and you know, I, I'Ll segue a little bit into your video content. I see, you know, you bring your son on screen as well and there's something to be said about this hobby, right.

SPEAKER 2: That, that, that those, you know, that it brings sometimes families together like that you and your dad with his collection that he, you know, he pulled out of the military trunk. You sharing, your hobby with, with your son, as well. I love those. You know, what, whatever family. Right. Father to son, mother to daughter, mother to son, grandparents, to the grandkids. Right.

SPEAKER 2: Because we, we forget how long cards have been around. Like you, like you said, your dad never even said that he had these cards yet. They're sitting in the bottom of this trunk to, to be, you know, revealed and then, and moved and graded and, and learned in that process, right?

SPEAKER 2: I love those, those stories with family bonds and, and, and stuff like that with your, with your own son is, has he taken an interest in, in the hobbies with, with, with your help? Yeah.

SPEAKER 6: So, so also at my parents' house, I actually, I collected Pokemon cards in 1999.

SPEAKER 6: You know, my friends went through that phase and, and I was right there with them as, and I'm sure your card shop sold Pokemon cards and I had I had the whole full complete bases set of, of the first set of Pokemon cards.

SPEAKER 6: And and whenever I had my dad's collection, I also sent my big three ZR Blas Toys Vinosa to PS A to get graded and, and my son, before this all happened, my son was big into Pokemon video games, big into the, he started dabbling in the cards a little bit. But then when he saw those cards come back from psai, I ended up getting a APS a eight on my, which is amazing with it being a playing card.

SPEAKER 6: But, when he saw those grades come back, it lit a fire under him for, for Pokemon collecting and, and, and that's something that we spend, you know, we spend a lot of time working together, working on some of the sets.

SPEAKER 6: I buy him booster boxes. Christmas time comes, he gets a lot of cards and, and we've actually graded some of his, modern cards.

SPEAKER 6: But, he's, he's dabbling a little bit in baseball. You know, I've been getting him on some videos talking about Clemente a little bit. I, I'm not, I'm not the type of parent that I'm gonna, I'm gonna push him on it. I'm gonna kind of suggest and, I'm happy that he's doing something in the hobby even if it's Pokemon right now. And, yeah, it's been a, it's been a fun experience.

SPEAKER 2: Yeah. No, no doubt. I, again, I, I love the stories, like that. Theo and, and, you know, I may not know Pokemon, like you said back in the day we, we carried it. But it's, it's, just another part of the hobby. It's just, you know, a different, a different hobby but the same hobby, it's trading cards.

SPEAKER 2: It's just, instead of sports, I'm gonna put you on the spot with one of these questions right here. Being AAA Pittsburgh, you know, Pennsylvania guy and Barry Bonds and, and we know the whole, you know, HGH stuff.

SPEAKER 2: I don't like the, the users of that. But I mean, many will tell you myself included. He, he was probably a hall, not probably he was a Hall Of Famer before that, that happened. What are your kind of thoughts when you think about Barry Bonds as someone who's, you know, kind of lived through his era and seen him maybe even more up close than, than some others.

SPEAKER 6: Yeah. I mean, I, I don't like how, you know, the relationship between him and Pittsburgh kind of transpired, when he left and it seemed like there was some bad, bad blood there. And it doesn't seem like he speaks fondly about his time here even though, you know, we came really close to some to a championship.

SPEAKER 6: But, but as far as, as far as his, his legacy, I do, I do really firmly feel him. And Roger Clemens II, I don't know how you can argue, Barry Bonds.

SPEAKER 6: He, he, it's so hard for me to describe Barry Bonds to somebody who didn't get to see him and I know, that's not you. I'm just saying like a kid nowadays, he was so dominant and, and I would compare it to Shaquille O'Neal when they had hack a Shaq.

SPEAKER 6: And then the kids still wouldn't understand that. So I, I literally have no example of how dominant he was and I understand on steroids, but he was so dominant. They walked in like three times at a baseball game. It was, it was, it was, it was insane.

SPEAKER 2: Like, like, II I walked in when they walked in with the bases loaded already, they would walk or run.

SPEAKER 2: You know how I describe them. Is, it's almost like Tech Mobile, you know, like with the Bo Jackson character, you can just he was like the, the, the baseball version of the Bo Jackson in, in Tech Mobile. And you know, that's the sad part for me was he was on, he was, he was, he was gonna be a Hall Of Famer without it.

SPEAKER 2: And I just wish, you know that he, he didn't use, you know what I mean? And we can say that about a lot of guys. But what, you know, here you got a guy that, that was going to be a Hall Of Famer without it. And because of that decision, you know, and, and I think, I wish he, he was more contrite about it. Like, hey, a lot of people were using it. I felt like I needed to to compete.

SPEAKER 2: You know, especially as I got older.

SPEAKER 2: And, and, you know, just some sort of, contrition, that would go a long way, you know, towards my feelings. But, you know, you look at some of the stats Theo me and my son had this conversation a couple weeks back and he was, he pulled it up on Google. Like they're, they're, they're crazy.

SPEAKER 2: They're, they're insane, just like ops and, and all these stats that are just like, like he's, he leads in and whoever's in second is not even, they're not even in the same zip code, let alone close. And, you know, like my son says, like he should be, I, I know what he did, but this guy is a Hall Of Famer before that.

SPEAKER 2: And I, you know, you know, that's the distinction that someone would for, for it to happen. Someone's gonna have to say that like, I know what this guy did, but if you just take the stats before he allegedly, like, he's still in the hall here.

SPEAKER 6: So somebody not to cut you off, but somebody I can show me a stat today. They had Mookie bet stats for his career so far. I'm, I'm trying to think of how many years Mookie's been playing so far and they had Barry Bonds stats in the city the same period from rookie year to Mookie's.

SPEAKER 6: So it was like a six-year period before Barry Bonds was on steroids. Mookie Betts and Barry Bonds have identical, if you Google it, if you don't believe me, they have identical stats in home runs, runs RBIs. It's, it's insane. It just gives you an example of if somebody's like, how good was he prior? Just look at, look at that.

SPEAKER 2: Yeah. Yeah. No, no doubt. And, just, I mean, tremendous defensively as well, just sad that, you know, I, that, you know, he should be there and, and because of all this, he's, you know, at least for now, he's on the outside looking in, I wanted to get your take, you know, being a Pirates guy kind of, your, your assessment, of that.

SPEAKER 2: You know, we spoke at the National, you know, your kind of thoughts, you know, maybe what, you know, if you want to share a pickup or two, but what you thought it was, it allegedly, you know, it apparently broke the record to me. It didn't feel it was how busy it didn't feel crowded.

SPEAKER 2: You know, but again, they added 200,000 square feet since the last time it was there at the. So maybe that's why it felt a little more, airy, your, your thoughts on, on, on what you saw and experienced there. Yeah.

SPEAKER 6: So it was my first National. So, so I don't maybe have the perspective you have. Because I don't have much to compare to.

SPEAKER 2: So, so I've only been just, I've only been to five so I don't wanna make it like in double digits. But II I was to a Chicago one prior, I think actually that the three of them I've been the three of the five I went to have all been in Chicago. So that's, that's where I'm just kind of drawing the comparisons. But go, go ahead.

SPEAKER 6: So I felt like I felt like it especially I think it was Thursday and Friday. I did feel like it was pretty crowded.

SPEAKER 6: It's kind of hard to maneuver. It wasn't impossible. You could, you could politely wait your turn to go to a table, which was fine. I did feel that the the heat issue which everybody talked about was pretty bad at times and and I talked to a couple of dealers and they actually, they, they had to call the ambulance to take a couple of people out because of the heat. So that was definitely an issue.

SPEAKER 6: My, my, I could literally bring my shirt out when I got back to my hotel. But as far as other things outside of that, I I thought the dealers were ready to deal.

SPEAKER 6: There were a few that, that weren't, that just wanted to do the standard 10% off of everything, didn't want to talk about comps. I just, I just walked away from those dealers. I went to dealers that were willing to deal.

SPEAKER 6: And there were a good amount of them. I, I thought, I thought there was actually a bigger selection of vintage than I expected.

SPEAKER 6: I thought there was a lot more baseball than I expected. I know baseball is the, the biggest, the biggest car, you know, the biggest thing in the hobby. But I just expected to see more, you know, football and basketball than I did. Which was fine with me because I only collect baseball. But the other thing that, that I thought was, needs improved is, is the, the layout.

SPEAKER 6: They, they, they had all signs, not in the right places.

SPEAKER 6: You couldn't find table numbers.

SPEAKER 6: It was, it was very hard to maneuver in there. I, I had a situation where John Mangini was coming over to help me me look at a card and it took him a half an hour to find where I was at. And, and it wasn't his fault. I was on the phone with him and, and, and it, it was, it was pretty, you can get turned around in there. It's not really laid out like gritted, like you would think.

SPEAKER 6: So that was kind of my, one thing is I, I kind of wish it was a little bit easier.

SPEAKER 6: I thought the corporate area was way too big.

SPEAKER 6: I know, they pay the bills, but I just, I just felt it was just way too big. And, the other thing that I really wish, and I know, I know that it's probably never gonna happen is, is I wish they had like three separate rooms. I wish if you sell 60% or more vintage, you're in this room. If you sell 60% more modern, you're in this room and then anybody who's 50 50 is in this room.

SPEAKER 6: And I wish they had like a like a six table area for Pokemon and they just put them over in the corner and you knew where it was at. I just, I just feel like being a customer, I feel like, you know, you don't walk into Target and you don't have to go all around the store to find men's jeans. You know what I'm saying?

SPEAKER 6: It was, it was kind of, a little bit frustrating at times when you were trying to look for a certain item and you had to literally try to get around the whole, get around the whole show floor. But I don't wanna be Debbie Downer. I had a great time. They were great people there. Like I said, the dealers were awesome.

SPEAKER 6: I, I enjoyed watching your show. You were on twice. My biggest complaint about your show was the area it was in. They had you in there with the breakers. It was very hard to hear.

SPEAKER 6: Even with microphones, I honestly like, like they should show the, the, the, in my opinion, they should show the stage more respect. The stage should be in an area which is regular card tables. So you can actually hear what the people on the stage are saying. But, I think I said enough.

SPEAKER 2: No, I'm gonna back you up on some of this stuff and, and it's great to have opinions, right. I mean, and, and, you know, they, they're not gonna throw a perfect game so in their defense a little bit. So let me, let me, let me kinda counterpoint.

SPEAKER 2: It's not really counterpoint because I'm gonna agree on, on probably, most of the Thursday was tremendously hot. I don't know what happened Thursday. I pressor broke. I'm not a, an guy, I'm not gonna pretend to be, but Thursday was unbearably hot and, and II, I agree with you.

SPEAKER 2: And I could see, I remember saying like, I'm not even like walking fast and I'm working up a pretty good lather here, you know, someone that might be older or have some underlying conditions, COPD emphysema, you know, this, this could be trouble something, maybe that's some of what you heard, what people had to have, you know, emergency service 10 to them.

SPEAKER 2: So I don't know what happened Thursday, Friday and Saturday seemed to be better, in the heat index car, category. So I don't know if they fix something, I'm not gonna say it wasn't still hot, but Thursday was the like pinnacle of, of heat index where I've, I, you know, made note of it like this, something's wrong.

SPEAKER 2: Like, I don't know what's going on here, but it's like the temperature outside is similar to yesterday, but it's way hotter in here today and I don't know why.

SPEAKER 2: So I, I agree there. I've never, I'm sure it's been said before Theo, but I like what you said with keeping maybe having like a vintage room, a more modern room, a non-sporting or trading card games section because those people, you know, I like vintage, right? I can kind of know where I want to go first.

SPEAKER 2: I'm not saying I won't look at the other rooms or the other tables, but at least it gives me a better plan of attack. The one bad thing with Chicago's layout and I think it be became worse with the additional square footage is, it's not a rectangle like Atlantic City was he kind of knew like, hey, the east side is the entrance.

SPEAKER 2: The, you know, the west side has two bathrooms or, you know, I'm, I don't, I'm just making it, but you kind of navigated better. You knew the terrain I got lost and every time it's been in Chicago, I'm not even gonna pick on this side.

SPEAKER 2: I'm not gonna, you know, I thought I remember saying to myself, I should have one of those lost kid tags. Like, so if someone finds me, they know where to like bring me to cause I was like, how do I get out of here? Well, same thing what you said even meeting somebody, someone would text like, hey, let's meet here in 15 minutes and you don't get there in time.

SPEAKER 2: It's like the Amazing Race. I felt like I felt like they should be filming me. Like, will he get there in time before the timer runs out? You know, it, it was easy to get lost. It was easy, sort of to get. I wanna say, disoriented, like you don't know where you are. But like, hey, how do I get back to this table?

SPEAKER 2: Ii, I thought I remembered where it was and now I'm looking for it and it's like, I have no clue. It's like, it's, it was, I get it. I get that I do like the idea of having sort of segmented areas, vintage area. I think some dealers, I'm a dealer myself. I don't set up at the National. I think some dealers would give thumbs up on that.

SPEAKER 2: The, and then I think you'd have a segment that would say I don't even though I'm all vintage, I don't know, I, I wanna be with everybody like I don't want to be kind of segmented out or, you know, And I get that too. I like your idea. It would be something if I, if I was one of the powers that be, you know, I'm sure they have discussions and meetings and correspondence with their longstanding dealers.

SPEAKER 2: It would be something I would throw out there at least to get initial dealer. Hey, what do we think of this? You know, not, maybe won't happen next year but it's something we're batting around right now, you know, just kind of feel the temperature in the room.

SPEAKER 2: You know, they asked the dealers where they want the show to be right. Throw that idea. What do you guys think? And ladies, what do you, you know, think of this kind of thought if you're all, if you're 100% vintage, you know, we're gonna, we're gonna create as much as we can. I mean, not depending on the raffle and how that all goes, but as much as we can.

SPEAKER 1: Someone's at my door, I've got to get that be right back.

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SPEAKER 1: We are back.

SPEAKER 6: Yeah, the, the point I was gonna tell you is II I interviewed the dealer on my show. And, and I asked him about that idea and he said, the only negative is, he said, he said, basically what happens is, is, is we're tiered based off how long we've been going to National. So guys who have been there for 30 years, get first table picked so on so forth. He's like, I'm three years. So I'm down here.

SPEAKER 6: I said, I said, ok, ok, I get it. But ok, if this is the vintage room, this guy's gonna pick the first row of the vintage room. If this is the modern room, this guy's gonna pick the first row of the, if he's modern. I, I said you could still get optimal table place. Just you might have to pick this room or this room. That's the only difference. I said, I said, I don't get that argument. I'm sorry. That's what I said to him.

SPEAKER 2: Yeah. And, and you're right. And, and it can still go, the order of preference doesn't have to change. It's just when you get in, if you're a vintage dealer, you're in the vintage room, you, you, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER 2: I will tell you this as a dealer myself, I carry vintage and modern. So I would be, I don't know if it's 50 50 it might be 60 40 70 30 modern to vintage because I keep so much vintage for myself, the numbers would be higher if I didn't.

SPEAKER 2: So, you know, for me, I'm like, where do I go? I'm sort of a hybrid. You know, even though I love vintage, I want, I don't have a problem being in the vintage room, but someone might come in there and say, hey, this guy is 60% modern, like get out of here guy. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER 2: So, so like it, I think those dilemmas could pop up. But then you do, again, you do a room where it's, you're, you're, you're not just all vintage, it's just a little bit of, of an eclectic, inventory and I think you can do that. Well, you know, you, you know, not everyone's gonna be thumbs up, that, that will never happen with that many dealers, at a show.

SPEAKER 2: So, so, you know, I think you gotta kinda go with what the majority kind of like how they vote on where the next city where it's gonna take place. You kind of go with the majority. You may vote for a city and it doesn't win and you have a choice.

SPEAKER 2: You can set up there anyways or you can bow out and lose your spot. Right? And so, you know, and there'll be five guys waiting to take your spot, if you want to bow out. So, you know, II I think you, you almost have to come out of that approach. You want to share anything you picked up, at your first National. Yeah, sure.

SPEAKER 6: This here is, there's only 11 of these on the PS A registry. SGC doesn't grade them, so there's none on SGC. It's my most rare Clemente item. And I love it. It's a, it's in 1961. It's a Manny's Land baseball. It's actually, it was a souvenir shop in New York and they, they produced these, you could probably call them photos and, they had the, like all the all stars, like they have a Hank Aaron Manny's Land, a Mickey Mantle.

SPEAKER 6: But they're like the Hank Aaron's like pop six. As far as how many they've graded? I understand there's ungraded out there. But they're just, they're beautiful and this image of Clemente is like, is not on anything else. So it's a unique image and I was so thrilled to, to get this at the National.

SPEAKER 2: Yeah, that's very cool. Like you said, you just don't see, you just don't see them, that much. Now, was that an item you sort of targeted going in or was that an item that shows up on your radar? And you say? Ok, now, you know, let's, let's talk about this.

SPEAKER 6: Yeah. So, so I kind of, I've only been collecting Clemente for two years. So, I mean, I really, I, I know what I have and what I don't have, I don't need a checklist, so I don't need to walk in with a checklist because my focus is on playing days. Clemente. So, so there, it's pretty rare that I'Ll see something on YouTube or, or with a dealer that isn't something I know about.

SPEAKER 6: But so I knew about it. It's just like I said, I've only seen one of these sell on ebay once in the last two years. So that's one of those ones where, when you see it, you hope that you can get a deal done because the, those are the type of things I feel you should buy at the National because, you know, I mean, by all means by what you love.

SPEAKER 6: But if you buy a top card that there's however many thousands and thousands and thousands you could have bought that on ebay. You know what I'm saying? So that was kind of my thought for us to going in is, is Target items that I don't see on ebay.

SPEAKER 2: So, yeah, I like that advice like you said. Now I'm guilty of doing both. I fall on both side of the A But yeah, it's a great, you're gonna see stuff at the National as, as you just pointed out the, that you're just not always gonna see. They just don't, there's just not a ton of them.

SPEAKER 2: That's it. It's simple as that and, and with that many people at the National, that's where you're gonna find it rather than, you know, on a, on always on an auction platform. And that sort of thing and it's a great port, right? You'll remember that this piece.

SPEAKER 2: Now, I got that in 2023 in Chicago. And you know, it's just an incredible rare day that not a lot of people have in, in their collection, including Clemente collectors themselves. What, what's your approach to Clemente? Are you, are you mentioned like you only do playing day versions?

SPEAKER 2: Are you trying to get one of everything? Will you do duplicates. How, what's your approach? Like if you have something you're like, hey, I don't want another one or are there certain ones like I really fond of that? I'm gonna, I got it but I want another one or, or more than another one.

SPEAKER 6: Yeah. So, so my, my approach all along is, is I, is, I don't, I don't collect duplicates. I don't, I don't tend to fall in love with one certain Clemente card and buy five of them because I just, I couldn't pass it up. I, I tend to kind of get tunnel vision of. Ok, I got that off my list. I'm happy with it. I, I still am yet to upgrade one of my Clemente cards, which is kind of unreal.

SPEAKER 6: But my, my strategy was first to collect all the base cards and then to start doing, I hate to use a different word but oddball cards, serial cards, you know, just different, different cards that weren't just produced by tops.

SPEAKER 6: You know, this wasn't the only thing I picked up in the National. I also picked up the 1964 top stand up card at Clemente. I didn't have that yet.

SPEAKER 6: And, and that, like I said, that's not as rare or something like this, but it was something that I really wanted. And because my budget was bigger at the National than a normal day to day at my house. I knew I kind of had to go for it there. Because my wife would have killed me if I would have bought it at home.

SPEAKER 2: So, go back. It was go big or go home.

SPEAKER 2: Exactly.

SPEAKER 6: Exactly. So, just, yeah, so, so in the last two years I have an Excel sheet. I keep track of everything. I'm up to 95 playing days. Clemente, you know, individual items, none of them are duplicates. And, it's been, it's been a lot of fun. I never thought I would reach 95.

SPEAKER 6: So it's crazy.

SPEAKER 2: No, that's awesome. One other thing on your approach with, with your Clementes, do you tend to buy them already graded or do you like buying, taking a shot, buying some raw ones and then having them graded yourself? And, and so, how, what's your approach on that level?

SPEAKER 6: Yeah. So that's a great question.

SPEAKER 6: You could probably tell from behind me and I know we're our podcast too is, is I'm an SGC Truth truther.

SPEAKER 6: You know, they did me right during the pandemic. I love how I love how the Tuxedo looks. So I, my goal is that my whole collection is in SGC slaps.

SPEAKER 6: Obviously this man's land is the exception because they don't, they don't grade it yet. But, but my, my approach has been that items under $50. I tend to buy ungraded and items over $50. I tend to try to buy graded.

SPEAKER 6: There's been exceptions, the stand-up card I bought to the National, he had a price for $500. It was near MT condition. I ended up negotiating down to 4 30. I have never ever, ever went over 100 and $50 on a non graded item in my life. So it scared the crap out of me.

SPEAKER 6: To buy that. It's actually the SGC right now. And, hopefully when this goes up, there'll be an SGC reveal with the card, but I'm still worried about it because I, I personally, I, I don't like, I don't like taking that risk. I would rather the dealer take the risk of getting the card graded and then me knowing that it's authentic and it's, it, it's this great then me taking that risk. So that's kind of my opinion on it.

SPEAKER 2: Yeah, I get that. I'm, I'm similar, like that sometimes it's fun though to, to fly by the seat of your pants, as well, especially when at, at the end of the day, the outcome is actually, a, a good one, right. Get, get you, get you a little excited and, and waiting to, you know, see what that comes back as and, and that sort of thing. I don't want to jinx you or anything like that. Those are great cards of 64 stand-ups.

SPEAKER 2: They're generally not messed with too much, I think, you know, without seeing it, I think you're gonna be ok. You looked it over and, you know. Yeah, I know you mentioned the term near me if you're, you know, if you're saying that, I'Ll take stock and I think you, I don't know what grade you get but II, I don't think you have to worry about, you know, anything coming back kind of, or, or weird like that.

SPEAKER 6: Yeah, I mean, it's, it gives me confidence that I held in my hand and looked it over because I, I've only been to three counting the National, I've only been to three card shows. So I'm, I've bought in 95% of my collection on ebay. So yeah, like you're saying, it did give me that confidence of actually looking at it, looking at the size of it.

SPEAKER 6: You know, looking at it at different lighting. It did give me that confidence. I don't think I would have ever bought that card on ebay because I could never, you know, hold it in my hand to look at it.

SPEAKER 2: So I preached out in this show the right. It's great to buy cards online. I do it. I'm not, but there's, there's nothing that beats an in-person transaction and I'm not even just talking about holding or looking at the card, but I'm, I'm, I'm talking about the, the whole process of talking to the dealer negotiating that.

SPEAKER 2: And then if you get a deal done that feeling like, hey, I think we both are ok here. Like I got a good deal.

SPEAKER 2: The dealer is gonna be all right and, and you know, even the conversations that come over and you, you, you know, you make friends even that way and then you, you know, you've established something and you can come back, you know, maybe next year in, in Cleveland, you go to the same dealer that you bought a Clemente from and say, hey, I was the guy that bought this Clemente last year and you find another one you may need.

SPEAKER 2: Now you have some sort of, you know, credential not that you need one, but you have some sort of rapport to maybe get the next deal done, maybe the dealer will, you know, keep them in my, hey, this, I do that as a dealer. Like if someone's bought from me before and I know that they're more apt to get a better deal.

SPEAKER 2: It's just you reward sort of, of loyalty that way. And I think that's what you get at shows rather than in online and you get again, you, yeah, it's the one of the biggest thing, right? Seeing the card in person, right?

SPEAKER 2: Anyone can put a scan online and say, hey, here's for sale and that doesn't mean you're getting that card potentially. And we hear stories unfortunately like that so it nothing can replace an in person transaction to, to me whether it's selling or buying. So that's what card should not just the National, but that's what card shows.

SPEAKER 2: Give us those, those opportunities. I know you're, you're, you're starting a new channel. I believe with Pino man and James Perez elite hunters. I wanted to, tell everybody, what this entails what it's gonna be and, and what the, the, you know, it's gonna be about.

SPEAKER 6: Sure.

SPEAKER 6: And then the fourth member is John. His channel is called 3D eighties Kid. And, it's, it's so it's four of us. So our channel is actually the number four collectors. So it, it kind of has two meanings there. It's, it's four collectors and it's for four collectors. So our, our, our actual handle name is the number four collectors.

SPEAKER 6: And then for collectors and, the channel was really put together because, us four were, we were all doing, like, like live streams on our own and, and, we were doing, interview shows similar to yours on our own sometimes. And, and we kind of felt like we kind of felt like it was kind of random content, you know, there was no schedule.

SPEAKER 6: There was no, like there was no no threat, there's no tie between, you know, this week we have this one, this month we have this one. So we really wanted to make more, I guess you would call it more of a professional type of an experience for somebody on YouTube.

SPEAKER 6: And, and we, we, we said, why don't we band together and why don't we have, a live stream every Sunday at nine o'clock Eastern and one of us four will run that live stream. And then why don't we have pre-recorded weekly shows with other collectors?

SPEAKER 6: So, you know, some of the stuff we're gonna have a, we're gonna have a monthly show where we call out our favorite YouTube videos from the month and show clips from them. Like, so that's a way to, to promote the community through the channel.

SPEAKER 6: Like I said, I'm gonna be doing some one on one interviews with some other collectors to promote them and, and Pepino man's actually start in one way. He's, it's called Ask Pepino anything. So the community can, can write in questions of Pepino and he can call them out and, and answer their questions. So those are some of the ideas.

SPEAKER 2: That we've come that might get a little scary. I'm not just, you might wanna have a disclaimer at the beginning of that one but, but.

SPEAKER 6: No, I, I totally agree that, that, that's what's so cool about. This is we're all a little bit different and we all collect a little bit different.

SPEAKER 6: And that was one thing that we were really excited about is, is having a little bit of a different flavor for everybody.

SPEAKER 6: You know, my, my hope is that it's, it, it, in six months from now it's bigger than any of our four channels combined. And, and if there's a small channel out there that wants to do a live stream that just doesn't have the capabilities, doesn't have the stream yard set up.

SPEAKER 6: They, they, they reach out to us, we set them up and we let them broadcast on our channel to get, you know, that notoriety. So we, we really wanna make it a more of a community type channel.

SPEAKER 6: We're just trying to, we're, we're, we're still pretty new, but that's what we want to work up to.

SPEAKER 2: Yeah. And, and, and hearing you talk about it, man, I can tell you you, you're excited, you're, and, and you know the word that, that you said, right? The community, you wanna highlight other, you know, talk, you know, that's not easy for people to do. Some people are not good at that. Let me just put it down. Either they're not good at it the or they don't want to do it.

SPEAKER 2: Let's, let's, you know, speak plain English here, right? Some people don't like to shine light on somebody else. Let's put it that way or it may not even be that they don't like to, maybe they're not comfortable, there's all sorts of different reasons, right? I tried to do that you know, with this show and that's why it became, a guest show every week.

SPEAKER 2: It didn't start out like that. But I'm like, you know, I don't want it to just be me every week. That's me that, like, I don't want that. I'm sure other people don't want that. And that's where the, we have a guest now every week. Hobby Hotline is a show where we do with a bunch of different, content creators and different ones every week.

SPEAKER 2: So you're not seeing always the same faces. That's the, that community aspect, right? So whenever I hear another content creator talk about sort of promoting other people or pointing people, hey, check this person's content out, we find it's, it's pretty interesting.

SPEAKER 2: They don't have a, a big following yet, but we think you'll like it if you check it out that says a lot about you and, and the people that do that, You know what I mean? That they're willing to really sort of, you know, give someone else some shine. I, I like to say and, you know, I don't think we see enough of that. I think that, you know, we could, we could get more.

SPEAKER 2: But the fact that you're doing that with this new channel, like you said, even the name itself is, is geared towards letting people know that this is, this is everybody, this is for, for everybody, I think it, it, it speaks to, to what you guys are doing. I look forward to checking it out and, maybe even be a part of it at some point or another.

SPEAKER 2: Maybe if you like the video, you know, we're not known for our nation. We're, we're getting a little bit better but we're known more on, on the audio side for sure. But, it's great. You got some great people, in involved and, you know, then you got a little bit of a, a wild card in, in, in, for Pino, man. But that'll, that'll be fun in its own, right? As well too, right?

SPEAKER 2: Like you said, you've got, you know, four different personalities, four different, approaches and, and 44 different viewpoints plus the people you highlight and, and all that good stuff. So, when this, we're recording this before, it's obviously, gonna be released for audio. When is that, just so people know, when can they start looking for that.

SPEAKER 6: For the Four Collector channel? Yeah.

SPEAKER 6: It actually, our first, our first video came out today and, well, ok, today's so the end of August we started up here and, and we're actually doing an eight hour marathon this weekend. It'd be August 27th. It's, it's, you know, the most similar thing I can compare it to is Hobby Paua, but we're having 81 hour episodes with eight different hosts.

SPEAKER 6: And, it's right before football season. So everybody should be kind of available, getting ready, go back to school and, I know people are gonna be listening to this and it's already come out.

SPEAKER 6: But if, if you didn't get a chance to catch it live, obviously, the replays will be on the Four Collector channel. So I think it, it's gonna be a lot of fun. We got a, a lot of great guys coming on and I, I don't even wanna say names because I'Ll, I'Ll leave somebody out, but we have a lot of great content.

SPEAKER 2: Yeah. No, no doubt. And so anyone listening to this interview, it's out, it's stuff is, is on the, the channel, check it out.

SPEAKER 2: You know, good luck, I don't think you need it, but I wish you good luck. Give that out again. And anything else and like your own stuff as well. You know, you know, I want you to promote yourself as well as that, that channel. So, thank you.

SPEAKER 6: So, so my individual channel is called Clemente Collector.

SPEAKER 6: Just look up Clemente Collector on on YouTube and you can find my channel. I'Ll I'Ll still be making content on my own channel. It'll be more of my individual content.

SPEAKER 6: SGC reveals, You know, sometimes I do individual on Clemente pickups, things like that.

SPEAKER 6: So, so I'Ll still have my regular channel. And then once again our our collaborative channels called at four Collectors. And and like you were saying, I really appreciate, I really appreciate what you said though.

SPEAKER 6: But but I went to the National and it was one of my favorite vacations I've ever been on, period. And, and III I, you heard me, I said a lot of negatives there which, which I don't want to make it seem like it was a negative experience because it was so great.

SPEAKER 6: There were so many great friends I've made from YouTube and I, and, and, and I just, I love doing things like this. I love, I, I love getting to know people better and, and starting to text people and, you know, not just the YouTube relationship also being able to call them on the phone and, and celebrate pickups and things like that.

SPEAKER 6: So, so, it's just, it's just been a lot of fun. I just, it's been a iii I just hit my one year anniversary. I just, I, you, you could never told me that that this is how many friends I would have after one year. It's been awesome.

SPEAKER 2: Yeah, it's crazy. And, and, and going back to the National stuff, that's his opinion. I've said the same thing that doesn't mean we didn't have fun and we're not going again. I mean, I God willing and I plan on going to everyone. I, I can get to.

SPEAKER 2: So we're just critiquing the, the, it's like when you go to the restaurant you enjoy, you might enjoy the meal. Maybe something else wasn't the greatest like. But it doesn't mean we're not going back. It just means, you know, this happened, this happened. Let's talk about, that's how we get better. Right?

SPEAKER 2: Is talking about things we can improve upon whether it's the National, our own content, whatever, whatever it might be. Nothing's perfect. So there's always room for improvement and I didn't take it that way from knowing you a little bit and I think most people get it and and and wouldn't be taking it that way as well.

SPEAKER 2: Well, Theo I appreciate you making some time Shane, some of your pickups, some of your thoughts the new, look forward to the content on the new channel, urge everyone else to check it out. And continued success, man, I'Ll, I'Ll be keeping in touch and we'll we'll have to have you back on sooner rather than later.

SPEAKER 6: Thank you so much for having me, John. It's, it's great getting to know you and I feel like I have another friend now out here and it's really looking forward to more conversations and you you're a Steeler fan like I am and I really think we're gonna have a great season this year. So hopefully, maybe during some of the great moments and some of the bad moments we can text each other.

SPEAKER 2: So, yeah, I definitely, well, let's, let's keep in touch and, we either we either celebrate together or we'll com or we'll commiserate together either way, let's hope we celebrate more than commiserate. But, you know, I'm a huge dealer guy as, as you know, and so, you know, always love, you know, talking steel or football picking on Matt Canada who I'm not a huge fan of.

SPEAKER 2: But we could do a, we could do a whole another show there. I'm, I'm not on the mat, I'm not on Matt Canada's Christmas card list for obvious reasons. But listen, I'm hoping I'm singing his praises here soon. I'm not, I don't root against my own team. Obviously, I'm just basing it off for two years.

SPEAKER 2: But, let's say hopefully year three is the charm for him and his offense preseason. I know by the time the series will be into the regular season, but preseason things look pretty good, but I don't really get excited till the games count in the real standing.

SPEAKER 2: So, but yeah, we'll definitely be talking, we'll be talking, we'll be talking sports guard and steel football, just the same and I look forward to it. Thanks. Thanks Theo. Thank you, John. Great. Catching up with Theo had a great conversation like I said at the National, his first one and I don't care, you know, whether it's your first or your, your 20th. Right.

SPEAKER 2: You know, we have opinions, improvements and, glad he shared some of them agreed with, the majority love how he gets his son, involved in the hobby and on his show and, good guy. Right. We talk about, I talk about good guys a lot and, he checks those boxes was, we'll have him back out as long as he wants to come back. So, really appreciate what he's doing for.

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SPEAKER 10: That's a wrap for this week. Huge. Thanks to you, the listeners out there because without you, there is no ice.

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