Ep.179 w/Ty Wilson of Bench Clear Media

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Alright, welcome to episode 179 of sports Carnation. Hope this podcast find you. Well little personal update in my hunt for the 48 Leaf. Jackie Robinson did get to bed in a couple auctions. On I'm golden. Just missed out on a couple a couple out for a leaf. Jackie's on that site, but I'm onto another big-time auction site. And so the search continues there again, no, real timetable, got the Dallas show coming up where I don't have it by then. That'll be on my list. Hopefully to maybe get one in person and truthfully. I'd rather get In person than ocean, but you know, Beggars, can't be choosers. Got a great guest today on the show. Ty Wilson from breaker culture, bench, clear media, and he's got a new show called chasing cardboards. Got a American Pickers type feel. I've seen episode one and very well done and think it's some great content and maybe some content. It might be seeing, you know, on your big screen. But you know, or your your TV I should say and has that kind of feel to I'm going to talk about that show bench clear. What time does great conversation? This guy's one of the busiest guys in the hobby of No Doubt. And I always love having those guys on number one, for them to make time when out of their busy schedule. To come on. I'm appreciative. 

Of that, but I always like to sort of pick their brain, see what makes them tick and how they get. You know, that work-life balance, you know, what's their secret? And always fun to hear when those folks kind of explain how they do it. So, great conversation, and thank you, enjoy, and we'll learn a little bit more about chasing cardboard. So, with that being said, let's get the party started. So if everyone, it's Brody the kid always remember the hobby is the people. Peace out. This sports card shot is your small town local card, shop with a global reach located in New Buffalo MI, Michigan. The shop is one of the most accessible in the midwest. In addition to being an authorized Panini direct dealer, the sports card shop, carries all major trading card Brands, including Tops Upper Deck, Pokemon Yu-Gi-Oh, and more with all that new wax, a half million singles and showcases full of grated cards. You're sure to find Great for your collection. Whether you're just starting out or a seasoned collector, the sports card shop is your One-Stop shop. So call us come see us or visit us on the web and social media. Our phone number is two six nine four, six nine zero, one four. Zero website is the sports card shop at Mo co.com. The sports card shop is part of the Moko. Retail Group connecting Sports The Hobby and people around the world. 

All right. Joining me now on the sports card shop at Moco guess line, a man of many Townsend by one of the busiest man in the hobby. I'll say she's going to be traveling the world will talk about or I should say the country will talk about that during the interview, but from breaker culture, bench, player media, and the new show, chasing cardboard. Mr. Todd Wilson. What's up? How's it going? It's going man. You're Is hot. It like it is and then it's all downhill from there. You know, you're a busy guy. Yeah, I don't know. I drink. Lots of coffee. Maybe that's it. Yeah. Well, I do too, but I think it's working better for you than me. So, you know, let's start out. I mean we don't have to do like an original. I mean, you've been doing this a few. Few years, you're not new, you know, you did the breaker coach or podcast and then your form, you know, bench clear media, which was a culmination of different shows including multiple that you did yourself. What, you know, when did you kind of brainstorm that? You know, how did that all come about? So again, it's been two years now, so brick a culture started as let me go interview Breakers and let me go interview people in the hobby because at the time, I mean, gosh, six years ago, there just wasn't a lot of podcasts. Thank you. 

I started really close to each other back in the day and then it evolved into. Hey, let's see if we can make this like a network in the sense that there's lots of content coming out. And so I I got talking with Jeff Paki who is now a VP of marketing over at Panini. He left for better things you all and then it kind of different folks, kind of joined and it evolved into what it is. Now with Mike, one hand, Tyson banker and not Coleman doing all the great production work and there's been guys that have come in and out. Out and we're still pushing out content, loving it. So yeah. Yeah, you know, if people don't realize this show and Fridays and then, just me on Mondays called hobby, quick adjust my big mouth and little bit shorter for everyone's sake and, you know, people are in again. I'm not trying to, you know, Pat ourselves on the back, maybe a little bit, you know, it's there's a lot of work that goes into it people, you know, it's a labor of love. 

I think I can speak for you there. But did you know, there's a lot of work especially to be consistent when you're when you're telling people. Hey, every Monday every Friday, every to whatever day your, you know, your eyes and there's a lot of responsibility there, but it's fun and, you know, you got a great team, it makes what you do seem seamless. It's not as probably a seamless as it as it seems, but comes out that way. Like you said, that's a testament. And the folks that you have on your team and you know, we talk to, you know, you might you make a great point when we kind of start, I started in November of 2018 with sports card nation. And like you said, we're just a few shows. I mean, it was, you can count them on less than probably two hands literally. And here we are. And you know, mid 2022, almost no, shortage anything anymore. You know, I've even heard some other content creators. 

Say we actually have two months. It's oversaturated. I guess, you know, asking when you know, again we're going to bed for ourselves on the back here, kind of being sort of early into this genre Niche, if you will, I mean, what do you say to maybe other content creators that say, there's, there's too much if you agree the, you know, I might, I'll answer the question my own question first. I kind of think, you know, I guess that's up to, you know, the consumers to, I guess decide. Whether it downloads and Views, and that'll that to me, that that sort of sorts that out. But, you know, I mean, we all watch or listen to what we want. And, you know, I I don't like being that guy that says you can't do it. But but I can or your stuff stinks and mine doesn't I've never, you know, it wasn't really raised like that. And so I don't really take that stance. I just say, you know, if it's good content people are going to 

Able to make that determination. Not me for you. I mean, we do. Individuals week, we download or watch something but as a as a mass consumer, they're going to, they're going to have the final say now, I agree. If someone came up to me and said that, there's too much, which there's many people have? I agree. I think there's too much, right. There's too much of the same type of stuff out there. Yeah, when we you and I, when we come up with schedules and agendas, it's like the hardest part. Is not getting on are it's how do we talk about something? We haven't already talked about is the hobby you just gets repetitive. Right? So you have to be creative in the way you present it. It and I get tired of seeing the same, the same topics, the same sudden thumbnails. It just gets old, you get this fatigue. He had the 121 content. Again. I won't, you know, no one cat that I doesn't do much for me because I do shows. I'm a deal. I go to shows as a consumer. So I'm going to just kind of filming like walking around to show see and Deals. I've kind of done that for like this. Would be as five or six figure deals. I get it. You don't see those all the time. If pretty rarely so I get the excitement in that. But just, the normal kind of day-to-day show business. When I say Show Business, a fucking card show stuff, that doesn't really move my meter because I did my first show as a 15 year old kid and that give away my age, which I'm not shy about. Anyway, that's 34 years ago, and I've other than a few years of 

The hibernation, I really done chose literally, at least, at least one, if not multiple every year. So, it's sort of I've seen it. You know, I've seen it. I don't want to save seen it all, but I've seen so much of that that, you know, seeing it, you know, in a v-log. It's just doesn't move my meter. Now, that's not to say those folks that are producing that content. They're working hard. They're putting in the grind. I'm not critiquing that. I'm just saying the actual You know what? It is itself doesn't doesn't it's not something I normally would watch anymore. My audio guy while I'm driving that sort of thing. Yeah. Anyway, you know, it's funny. We joke sometimes. Mike and I are about just how easy it would be to get clicks. Just going to shows, go to the Dallas. Carter. He's there, right? Anytime we want and you guarantee yourself, thousands of years, but the hard part and the thing I think we get most excited about is how do you create content that engages people? 

For in make something a little bit differently about the Hobby and to your point like watching someone traded card and a deal. Like, okay, I guess you check a box and you get the views, but anybody could do that, right? Anybody could do do. Yeah, it's funny to what I went to the National and Chicago 2018. I've um, I I joke with on my own show about this. I felt like not an actor, but I almost felt like an actor. I was on a movie set and I was like crash and seeing they were Just tried pounds all over the place and I'm just walking around. I'm not, you know, it's like every corner you turn your in a potential shot. And you know, I'm old school. So so it was sort of an and again, I'm not you know, I knew video content creation was happening. I was a naive but just to that level really surprised me was like every every other table. Somebody was filming whether it be with a professional kit to try. 

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Camera and a selfie stick, you know, whatever every level was covered and it almost felt like I had to tiptoe through through roles and tables and stuff because I was like in shots, you know, I might thing was a, you want an ugly guy at some, go ahead and capture me and Cameron, you know, it's gonna, it's not gonna help you what you're doing, but, you know, just it just, you know, I've even heard a couple shows tie like kind of, you know, put that sort of like, Hey, we're not allowed with cameras, you know, sort of, you know, for the customer experience. Be no offense, guys. And Ladies, we want to just have a card show and, you know, cell, phones fine, but we don't want like, you know, tripods and, you know, camera Crews. And that's or I mean it's not common but the I've had seen a few shows kind of, you know, put that limit on there and I get it. You know, I'm not for for free speech. 

Shouldn't producer judge, but I get where it comes from and, you know, I when I go to a show as a consumer, usually, they're just like you and love, you know, talk to people. I know people for the first time by some cards, and, you know, not feel like I'm walking in, on the scene, every 10-15 minutes, but you know, it's again, you know, people like that stuff. Going to watch it. It's it's going to happen and it's not I guess for It's not my place to say, you know, he can't do and that'll be up to in the cases. Like I mentioned a show promoter might decide to ultimately put that sort of restriction and I'm sure you know, I'm sure those guys that graders are real fans. When that happened for their show was they say right? So I'm sure you know, we're just weird. I think that just kind of comes with the territory of the explosion. You know, the kind of, yeah. All right. We're going to step aside for real. 

Break, but we'll be right back with more, when Tyler Wilson. Sports coordination is back with more with Ty Wilson. I'm a dad. You're a dad. I got one 22, year old kid. You've got six kids. God bless you younger than 22. I'll say that. And you like I said, you're one of the busiest guys, in the hobby, on top of being a dad, and husband. I mean, how how do you balance that out? I mean, that whenever I have someone on the show, tied at, that is a mom or dad that does, you know, this kind of stuff. 

You know, I am always enamored by that. How did they do it? What's their, you know, approach and it's almost everyone had, it's like a fingerprint. It's kind of unique to whoever the person is. It's not, you know, kind of like a sofa here. Do you know where everything's the same? But you know, once you know, how do you do it? I guess is the simplified way to say it. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I think the biggest thing that I've learned over the years is for it to work. Work and yeah, probably put more time into the hobby from the content side than a lot of people do. But you just have to be open and honest with your spouse and your kids, right? Like it's it's a balance between you doing a lot but also just, hey, I'm going to communicate this with you, and if there's a problem, if it's too much, we could communicate back from. We'll figure out a good balance. The worst thing I see in some people is trying to force things without communicating with your spouse, your kids, or even hiding stuff, especially when it comes to purchasing things, right? You're hiding things and I'm just 

Communication is absolutely key and it's working for me. For sure. Yeah, it's funny. You mention that, and I pretty sure I've mentioned this on. At least, one of my shows is not more than one. One of the things I didn't get in trouble. You know, I've been married, 23 years. So it's at this point, we're locked in. But one of the things, my wife did, my wife could care less about the hobby of cards. It's not her thing. She knows very little about it. She knows it some stuff. As Ford some money, she's probably waiting for me to kill off and then cut my son too. But but all joking aside, you know, the one, I don't want to say got trouble but a lot of times I would schedule interviews or different things and I would tell her like the day of a later today at like 8:00. I got yes and violence. Short notice. So what? We do now and it's worked wonders. We have a dry erase like monthly calendar. It's in the kitchen. And whenever I schedule something and not just contact, create whatever, if I'm playing softball or whatever, you know, an appointment, it goes on the Whiteboard. As far ahead is as I can put it and it just commune like you said, communication is key and she knows, you know, whether it be two three days, two weeks ahead and we can kind of Schedule around that would kind of our Rule and it works both ways is as long as we don't have any plans already together. We can kind of make some plans, so long as it doesn't screw our plans up and so that whiteboard was sort of a game changer and, you know, again, it didn't get, it didn't get testy, but really kind of open those lines of communication up to to avoid. Maybe that pratfall before we can really get into it and 

Since we started doing, and she puts our stuff, my son will write his stuff. He's still at home right now. And that way we all know. Hey, what's going on tomorrow? What's going on the next day next week? And so on? That's how we do it here. And again, you know, I have, you know, one adults on it 22. So I know when I, you know, six kids got beautiful. I think there should be an award for that. If there isn't one. I trust my reap the rewards every day. I get to explain. It's good enough for me. I love it. I will say it does help because on the brake and culture side, right? Most of what we do on the brick, culture side is sell cars, right? Pretty good-sized eBay business. My wife handles, all the shipping for that. So she's shooting 50 to 100 things a day. Another she's locked in with that. So she might despise cards, but at the very least she's interacting with printing with shipping labels. If I let my wife do that, people would not be getting there. 

Mostly sort of, you know, not not a good Dunnigan scenario. But you know, I love my Rollo printer. I will say that that, that Shameless plug for them. They're not, they're not a sponsor, but I'm being honest. Had things been a Difference Maker for me. I got it about a year ago, maybe a little little less than that. Just saves me. A lot of shipping time. So I'm changing into. Yeah. Yeah, so I got it. Ask you, you know, I know you spoke about it on your couch and I've heard from some of it. But yeah, for this show, you know, Fanatics getting most of the licensing here, playing pretty Cutthroat. It's business, right? People, you know, people don't like that to talk about the Hobby and in the business sense, but let's be real. We're talking about a billion-dollar industry, whether you like it or not. That's what it is. You know, what do you think? What are your thoughts? You've got your finger on the pulse here? What are your 

Fanatics are you are cautiously optimistic concerned, a static, whatever. You know, what do you think I would say for the most part on pessimistic about it? I would say there's a there's a lot of things that I think really concern me with the way that they'll probably handle it. I think a couple things like one, I think they're under estimating how important Distributors and Breakers are right. You're seeing I've seen multiple tweets about Breakers getting there. Allocations cut off their able to get lots of product and it sounds really great on paper. Like, hey, let's have one source and let's get it out to the, you know, to the front lines that Consumers Digest. It I think to this under estimating how important the hobby like veterans are on the group breaking side and take that away. I think a lot of momentum is sucked away almost to be the second. I just think from a economic standpoint. It's just really bad timing, right? It's just bad timing heading into this year. Yeah. I mean everything. Latian, is that a no 

Time high. I do I make this, you know, picking almost black dress and Sunday or political show but it is the truth. I mean, that's what it is. You can you can look at numbers and it's not a debate. It's an all-time record and not a not a good spot to be in the thing that makes me worried. I too would Fanatics is, you know, they pay, you know, they got this licensing but it's costing them, a pretty penny and we've heard And, you know, it's not official but we've heard. Unofficially, he's a 20-year deals with 20 years. You don't have to be an economics, major to know. A 20-year deal is going to cost you a big coin to procure. And there have been, you know, they're in it to make money. They're not, you know, I'm sure that if there's an element of care, you know, that they care what the hobbyist wants, and wants to deliver a great product. But at the, at the end of the day, went with the buck stopped, that's where it stops is. They need to make Money, they need to profit and when they're ready, that sort of, you know, deep in it if you will or have that sort of, you know, investment in it. That's what worries me is that we're going to see over production. Some people say were, you know, already there? I don't know about that. But you know, everyone's afraid of the, you know, drunk wax ever 2.0 is, it's been people like to throw around again. I'm not saying we're 

We're going there, but that's my fear is that they're just going to produce this stuff so they can make that investment back. And in the long run. It's going to hurt the image sort of the Hobby and you know, that YouTube your history guy. Like I am history tends to repeat itself. You know, we've seen something that happened in World War Two. That's kind of going on again. Similarly, now and hobby wise, you know, how Amy's is real life too. And I just that's that's my fear. So I would say I'm cautiously optimistic but I probably lean more. Like you said, a little more guarded and like, where are we going here? And going to step aside to hear from one of our great sponsors, but after that we'll be back with chasing cardboards. Ty Wilson, iron sports guards. Is your number one source, for all your PSA and other grading submissions. 

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Provide the card Savers, their chat rooms provide updates on all your submissions. They also offer wax options and single cards to cover, all the bases. Check them out on Facebook, at iron sports cards group, or on the web at iron sports cards.com or even give them a call at 1-877-560-4440. Sa Rob's. Got you covered. We are back with more which I just had recently to an incredible. Boom years. We all know if we live, we just lived through it and 

All good. Things have to at some point. Come to an end. I think we've seen you've caught stole the guy stole it from you. I give you credit anytime, I use it. But great term, hobby reset, you coin that I'm assuming and I heard you say it. And I said, I love that, you know, everyone wants it called a crash but correction and I just I think that's more apropos. Hobby. We said things have sort of like kind of cooled off calm down. New game and you know, some people are not gonna like that because some of those prices in turn have come back to probably where they really should be in, you know, at the end of the day and for those that come into the hobby that are just seeing, you know, and ask for two lines through it. You're not going to necessarily like that whether they stick around that's that's going to be on them. But again, I stoled that ensures how be reset but I think that's that's 

We're at and you know, when you think about, that's where we're at and everything else with Fanatics in the money that they're just kind of thrown around. I just again, I'm not a businessman on that level, but I just, you know, it's hard to Fathom how that works without, you know, some collateral damage and whatever that collateral damage might be and I can only speak, you know, we went, I'm in central, New York here. And, you know, during the recent Heyday, you could Can't find anything on the shelves and obviously people were complaining. I can't buy packs and boxes. And now whenever I go in the Walmart and their shelves are actually have stuff on it. And then I say to myself, I say to myself is that, you know, is that good? Or is it bad? Because it's, you know, full shells are nice when you want to buy something but, you know, one of those, the byproducts of those empty shelves, is a kind of a strong strong hobby. There's 

Adam. And and I'm not saying there isn't a demand now, but what we've seen to you know, this is we've seen, you know, Blaster boxes on the retail level, go up in price. They're not 1999 anymore in those days or in the rearview mirror, you know, we see 25, 27, 30 to 35, you know, we get into Mega boxes. You're looking at 40, 60 bucks and tops gallery. That has collected about that at least that one. Time at $75 and and you know, I joke there but you know, things are things are different. And so I don't, you know, one day we're complaining, we can't find the stuff and then when we do we're and I'm throwing myself under the bus to of not, you know, point at anyone. Then we're saying I don't know if this is a good thing that stuff's not really moving at the Breakneck speed it wants did so, you know, I don't know the answer. It's all like, we're all speculating. 

You know, for the moment, but I just, I don't know, like you, like, um, a little II probably tend to come to your Silo more pessimistic. I tried to be optimistic, but that inner voice, you know, in my head is like, ya know about this, you know, well, I think the reality is, like from as a collector of, there's always stuff to collect, right, that never changes. You had Hobbies bad obvious. There's always stuff to collect as an investor. You just you got the wrong. You just caught the top. Right? The last year and a half. If you got in, you caught the top Fanatics, caught the top and they're going to learn the hard way, right? Like the markets going to tell them when they're over printing, whenever whenever printing people are going to buy it. We're going to start seeing stuff on shelves and they're going to print less of it. And it's gonna take a while just as big cycle writes a big cycle. And unfortunately, like, when you have over printed product, entering a recession inflation, like crazy, it's just not a good recipe for Success. Yeah, you know, it was important. I mean, this is, this is old news, but, you know, 

You know, when Ivy boom it was we had people working from home with five tabs on their computer bonus package. Is from from unemployment, you know, bonus packages from from places of employment, for staying working and and getting the job done unemployment. You know, my wife actually was unemployed. She took a volunteer, lay off the help, someone else out there had young kids. He's a nurse and so she was unemployed for two weeks and I'll be honest with you. She made more in the two weeks. You took the voluntary layoffs. Then she did when she was working and three nurses. Did it with her her and two other nurses. When they called them back. She's a worker. So she went right back, you know, but to other nurses who were making more at home, were finding every excuse in the book, not to not to come back right away. Hey, can I have another week? I got a bunch of stuff, you know, and, you know, I get it. You know what I mean? If you're, that's human nature. 

Also money, I'll pay you more to be at home or less to come and drive in and commute. I mean, I'm not even picking on them. I get it. But you know, we were, you know, some people who are kind of spoiled and we're what's going on. We had to stimulus packages and you know, now we're on the better side. I mean, the pandemics obviously not over, but we're on the better side of the Hill, if if you will and things are the back to The New Normal. If you will there too, and sort of those Salad Days of like, I call them are sort of over now. And a lot of that discretionary income is not the same. And like you said, I think Fanatics eyes got big during that during the boom days. And then it's like it's a different landscape now, so it'll be interesting to see how they sort of navigate that no one had dared to show. 

Greater lot of smart people in that room. They didn't answer where they didn't get to, where they are by accident. They have a lot of analysts and people that do that in their sleep and are very good at it. So it'll be interesting to see, you know, how they navigate, I do you break it, you know, you make a good point. I think they're going to probably be a some mistakes here and there now have to adjust to them because things happen so fast. And sometimes faster than A human can even react to so, you know, but it's I just hope when people ask me, I just say, hang on your see. I don't know. It's, you know, I have my opinion but at the end of the day, we're all we're all on the roller coaster together. We don't know what curves coming up or yeah, or dip for, you know climb. So well, I'll just I'll close my thoughts on that by saying I might be passing pessimistic about what's kind of happening, but that doesn't mean you have to be a pessimist. 

As a person, right? Like you can still enjoy the Hobby in so many ways and even as a flipper as an investor, right, there's plenty of opportunities for you to find little spots in this hobby to do your thing, and I'd rather us be, you know, those types of voices and than anything. So yeah. No, I agree. And uh, listen, I've been doing this. I'm going to. I want to be in the hobby, you know? Yeah, that'd be my last breath. Good bad. And I've been there at bedtime. Just been there. Obviously, in recent times when I 

Thing was, you know, everything was a home run, no matter what it was. It didn't measure being, it could be nanny, nanny cards, and they sold out. And, you know, so I've seen, I've seen almost everything. I don't want to say, I've seen everything pretty close. You know, I'm just enjoying the ride and and like you said, there's, there's more than one way to enjoy the hobby. You time to take another quick break, but right after that we'll return with more with Ty Wilson. Are you and new sports car? Collector or someone that's returning to the Hobby. Maybe you're just looking for a friendly trustworthy Community to hang out with and enjoy. Collect Midwest, box, breaks has been bringing collectors together for almost 4 years with affordable, breaks helpful, Twitter Treads, and a Discord group pack with generous. People care about the Hobby and other collectors. Check out the brakes at Midwest box. Breaks.com first timers can use the coupon code M bb10 and save 10% on their 

Order, your first break mail will also include a bonus. Our goal is to bring you as much value as possible, even launched in NFP project dedicated to the Hobby. Find us on Twitter at Midwest box break. Welcome back. Here's more with Ty, Wilson and even pivots. Maybe, if something doesn't do it for you away, doesn't do it for you anymore. You can try a different angle before you and it just pack your cards up, sell them and, and leave the hobby list. That's truly what you want to do. I don't want to know. Stop by, you know, I owe, you know, I ever once a while. I'm sure you get into. I get a message like, hey, I'm discouraged. I want him thinking about selling and I'd, you know, I'm not a psychiatrist, but I try to get maybe a hobby. Maybe I get like an honorary hobby, Psychiatry. You know, I always ask the person, like what's going on. Why do you feel this way? What's got your angst up? And then, you know, when I find out what it is and, you know, I try to give them another way maybe to still be in the Hobby and 

To do it this way where you have more enjoyment and Les anges. I tell him like, listen, if you try that, we try something new figure out and you still not feeling good. You know, I don't want anyone to be unhappy either, that's not very nice. And, you know, ultimately, it's their decision and I'm a welcoming guy like, you know, one of the reasons, one of the reason the hobby thrives is going to have people doing it. And so I'll never you know, tell people to jump and get out of here. 

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Okay. Lives or angst or, you know, trouble financially then, you know, everyone's got to look at that individually and decide what's best for them. So but you know, I always I ever went to. I get someone that will you know, kind of what should I do? I'm not really enjoying having no more and I try to try to be as optimistic with them and give them some other ways to look at it. But at the end of the day they have to decide for themselves. So let's that's Let's pivot. I recently had racial. Di, you know public relations, those National on and you know, we've all heard the rumors YouTube by about maybe they'll be a time when there's to Nationals the younger rather than the one I asked them about it, you know, what are the you know with it. Will that be maybe something we see one day he kind of, you know, he was sort of vague but said hey they always look at things and maybe I'm kind of old-school. I like 

Sort of the one National I like I told him if he ever went to not that, they listen to me, but I said, my opinion is you know, she ever went to Nationals maybe have one being Central, you know, Chicago Cleveland and then alternate every year on the East Coast West Coast, you know, wherever that may be California meet, you know in the west coast and then and an east coast city that way because my day I try to Encompass everybody. I think man, you know, we have this one coming up here. In Atlantic City. If I live in California, you're in, you're out more now. Yeah, to the West. I kind of think. Oh, how will this affect everyone? I'm like, man that I lived there. This trip would be a lot more expensive to make and harder to pull off. I'm at said, for New York. I want to be driving to Atlantis City. So it's mostly it's completely easy, but it's so hot easier for me, you know, demographically that someone that's out in the west coast and, you know, I just 

I think about them too. So I don't really want to Nationals, you know, gonna head but if we ever went to that format, I like to see kind of a central one every year and then alternate every other year, East Coast, West Coast, and I guess my question to you, you know, what are your thoughts on to Nationals? And you know, if you know if you if you were went to Nationals, how would you want them to manage to National? I don't have a conviction about it. Honestly, too much, man. I like your idea. I think it's good to mix it up. Yeah, the West Coast kind of gets screwed over here because they don't get any options with the national. I, yeah, you're right. I mean good for West Coast to Atlantic City, like God, I'm probably not going like people from this. The team will go, but I don't know if I'm gonna make it out. This is too hard of a trip. You have to make it with kids, especially that's what the national I think, is really the best part about it, as getting your kids and everybody else to those cool experiences and plus it's in Atlantic City. It's not exactly a kid-friendly aware of it. So, 

You know, I don't know, there's so many good Regional shows now. Like you would agree. You you go to a lot of shows. I see I see your feet. The national doesn't quite mean as much now to me when you got so much good stuff happening at a local level. If you with you went to to I would care just as much as if you say with one. Yeah, and I'm going to piggyback off what you said. A question that I'm just spitballing here, but it's something I've asked other, you know, we are seeing a lot more shows, you got cold air. In Atlanta Dallas card shows become a beast in itself. You got the East Coast National and White Plains. I know I'm going to forget someone not on purpose, not intentionally, but you're seeing these rise of shows and even new ones in areas that didn't have unnecessarily shows before he, you know, I love shows, don't get me wrong, but some of the some of the Mystique about a show is you do when you don't have them all the time. So you look forward to, I guess a little bit of 

Predation of or concern analysts fear. Not scared about is like if we started having too many shows. It's kind of like too many too much product produce, right? I just worry that maybe the bloom is going to come off the rose a little bit mean, the shows the show and you have fun when you go but I just worried that they could be sort of an oversaturation of even car choke. You talk about fat cat, but, you know need you think so? Or you think at this point the demand is just so great enough. If that, you don't see that happen, I think ultimately the It tells you right? The market will tell us when this should, there's too many shows because they'll people stop going to shows, but I think there's a big over reaction that happened the last year with. Oh my gosh, you've been stuck in our house for so long. Now, let's get out and let's go to every car show possible. I think it's dying down a little bit. But the best part about card shows is they help reinforce the most important element of sports cards, and that is the community piece of it, right? You're going to be shows. Now. We went to one in Missoula, Montana. We did a video on it. You had so many kids walking around there. They weren't They're flipping our best and they were there like building their collections as a kid and that doesn't happen if you don't have a show. So there's a lot of that, where like, if we're going to have more shows and that's what we facilitate. Let's go, let's let's do more as that's what we need to Nabi. Yeah. No, I agree. And I'm a big kids and I started as a seven-year-old kid in 1979 and you can do the math. Whatever. He said, I will and you know, I'm you know, I was welcome did 

It just grew from there. We started working the card store. Did my first show on my own at 15 did my first store with a partner at 20 and you know, I was exposed early so we can you know, get kids early especially at an age tie which not all about other side. They understand when a kid opens the pack and pull something good. It's just human nature. Hey, what's it worth? Right? We all do it. Anyone had said, you know, whenever someone tells me, I don't care. What my car do? I feel like you're lying? Yeah, like I love you. I like you relying. I don't think you're bad guy. Or lady did not tell him the truth because I don't care who you are, right, you know, I show something in my wife that may be either purchased or pulled. And I mean, she knows what's that word? Right? Just human nature to aspirin or want to know, you know, what? Hey, what did I hit here? What did I get it, you know, so every something that you may not, someone may not do it. 

The value like that. They still kind of cure it to say there. They don't care thinks you're not being truthful but, you know, but and we don't when you start at six, seven, eight years old, even younger potential. I think, you know, I'm glad I started, you know, in 1979 before what we, he was a different hobby, you know, cards had some value, but we were just trading them, throwing them around. We didn't like a guy who threw it against the wall and then get up and stupid stuff like that. 

You know, now kids don't do that but or most kidnapped but you know, I'm glad I kind of entered at that point and sword. I've seen both sides of this right where I didn't care really what my cards are worth. I just like teams and players and you know now as a dealer in a Cellar there's that aspect too but I'm glad I lived sort of through both aspects of not just one, I think a kid today and today's social media where the world a smaller place Information can be had and literally, you know, Ms. I'm glad that, you know, I did grow up in that era so to. So I wish I was younger. No, get me wrong, but I think it would have changed how I viewed the hobby little bit. I think. And I'm not picking on the kids so their product or products of the of our environment. That's why I sort of am the way I am from starting in 1979 as a seven-year-old, so I'm not going to you know, I'm not criticizing kids and just saying, 

That's, you know, that's the error we're in. And so when you see a younger kid that maybe is not doing it for those reasons yet. And we're getting any sort of pure. I always like to see that when I'm at my table when I'm doing a show and you know, I always have some packs with me and kids come up to the table. I always make sure you give them a free pack and just just sort of pay it forward and be sort of an ambassador, you know, because I see See those, you know, those little kids were be, you know, 40-some years ago, but, you know, and you don't know, you don't know what that one pack to do, you know, I mean, it could be a reason why they stay in a hobby or not. It doesn't hurt. It doesn't cost me much. And, you know, they light up and, you know, a fair amount of daresay, you're giving them that it's his pull something big and it just goes a long way. And so kids in a hobby, I concur, 

It's, and we're seeing a lot more and that's obviously. Positive and in a good day, time to pay a couple bills, but we'll be right back with more with Tyler Wilson. Sports card nation has returned to talk with Tyler Wilson - the show's. Let's let's let's get to your new one. Chasing cardboard. I watched episode one yesterday, as you went through the Country of Texas as I called. It's not a state, that's bigger than some countries, but, you know, taka I could talk about that. But talk about Hannah, where the concept came will, yo