Ep.172 Jeff Hoferer of Panini America

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What is up? Welcome to episode 171 sports car Nation. Have a great guest today. I'm glad to call my friend, but he hasn't been on the show in two years and over two years, quite frankly. And a lot has changed since the last time. He's been on, he's got a new title working in the hobby now and he works for Panini and Jeff Howe for many, many know. Him as Pat geek from his web show and he does a podcast, a weekly podcast now for Panini and he's I think marketing director. He's replaced, big shoes, Tracy, Hackler shoes as he's moved on from Panini and Jeff has stepped in and those are big shoes. But man, if anyone can fill up, they got the right guy in Jeff. He's a great guy and really You know, it's a people person type of business and he's a people person and he's going to do very well. I know some will say, you know, you know, some people are replaceable and you know, we're all different. We all have different personalities, but you know for losing a person like Tracy, they got a great guy at Jeff and they're going to be they're gonna be alright, he's close with Tracy, so I'm sure he'll be leaving on him. 

If needed and for that transition, so we're going to talk about Hobby. Panini, how tough of it was a decision to leave the job. He had for this one. It's an interesting and fun conversation. I think you'll enjoy it. I know at least, I did I think Jeff could do, but I think you was well, so let's get to it. Hi, this is Danny blood with Baltimore sports collectibles. And I love what I do because the hobby is the people. 

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All right. I am real excited to have my next guest back at sports coordination. It's been a while. We'll talk about some stuff that's happened in between a lot is changing his last night on the show in June of 2019. That's that's crazy way too long, quite frankly, but better. Never from Panini kind of weird saying that but also cool. Mr. Jeff offer. Welcome. Welcome back. It's good to see you John man, that that intro to your show is new and that is epic. But that's very nice. I get a lot of compliments on it and then like then I started talking and then that it's like all downhill. 

Beacon you're now part of the Panini team. Let me kind of just talked about, you know, how that kind of, you know, what you can say, how that sort of went down what you do and I know you're excited and you have seen some of the stuff you posted doing some production work, which I've always said, you know, during the pancake days you had the best production. I was envious. That's why I don't do a lot of YouTube. I seen what you did. I'm like, forget about it. But that is well how this all came about. Oh man. Well first off, I can't believe. It's 2019 was the last time we chat on your show, man. It doesn't seem that long but time flies when you're having fun. So as you mentioned, I took an in-house job at panini from here in the broom closet right now, in its wild man in Tennessee. It's insane that that somebody can make a living working and 

It's guards and essentially just letting their friends know that there is new cards coming up. I mean, that that is the majority of what I do here is just marketing new releases and keeping keeping hobby. My title is Hobby marketing director. So, I'm the liaison between us and collectors. So I'm just keeping people like yourself, you know, informed about new releases. We have coming at ya and production. Like I said, you give bring some of that expertise or from the production. Duction side to, I mean, I got a gas of, its kind of a softball question. I'm guessing it makes the transition a little bit easier because you're not on is not only not unknown territory before you. Yes, so my wonderful mother likes to joke. She still can't believe that. I somehow got a job in sports cards full time, but she she jokes that I've been training. For this particular job, my entire life being a lifelong collector and then, you know, I have a marketing and international business degree from college and and then, you know, I worked in content, creation, video production, social media video production, specifically for a couple of years since then, since I was out of college, so that's what I'm doing here. I'm combining those two kind of loves and interest into A job. So it's pretty amazing. Yeah, you know, I watch when you got off work at position. Was it really did? He was it sub? You had to really think about, or was it kind of like a no-brainer for you? I am so, I had, I loved the job. I was at prior to this, it was, it was a great, very comfortable safe by. They've been in a production company for almost seven years, and I love the people I work with over there. So it wasn't, it wasn't a Leia. 

Was it was a surprise, a lot of people to hear like I did. I wasn't immediately like whatever I'm in, no matter you, no matter what the situation is. Tracy, gave me a heads up that this particular position. Tracy, a clerk losses, this year to me gave me a heads up into position was going to be a vacant, they're going to be interviewing some interviews and he said, you know, I would love to recommend you for the position which was the most flattering thing ever because I'm a big fan of Tracy's and he's been a 

Massive influence and mentor to me in the hobby just from the business side of things. And so I came over here and the team. They interviewed. I know they interviewed Manor, be several other people and I just kind of left it at that. I thought you know, it's what an interesting opportunity. I'll go meet, you know interview and then you know, if they if I don't hear from. No worries, like, I like the job on that, you know, but I would be silly not to at least come over here and talk to them about this crazy potential dream job. And so, I don't know how I got so lucky, but I ended up getting getting wonderful offer. And there was there was like, no, negotiations. It was, it was putting in the two week, notice of my old job and getting ready for a new adventure. And I do think to gonna slight tangent. 

It is important to continue those adventures in your life. And I think in retrospect, my last job. I had kind of come to a point where I was kind of on autopilot and it was very comfortable and very safe and in order to continue to advance your work and do the best work. You possibly can. Sometimes you have to challenge yourself. And here I am. That's all like you said. A lifelong collector. This is like you 

Dream job. You like kind of like, you know, your love the hobby love collecting. Sometimes we don't always want to know how the sausage but we like the sausage sandwich peppers and onions, but maybe like was that a thought that really entered your mind for for even this did you say, you know what to bring like a collector's perspective. I kind of know what I like and don't like The Hobbit wise, I'm going to try to figure that voice. 

That, that they don't already have some of those, or they don't care necessarily, but at least I'll have that opportunity. I think a little both, but primarily the ladder with my position, hobby marketing director, again, I'm Gaze on with people like ourselves. And I take I think there is a lot of responsibility with this position and and I want, I love that. I'm able to bring empathy to the position for collectors as I And what it's like, I've mentioned this a few times, but I personally have like 45 Open tickets with panini customer service. So I'm not going to like walk over to the other building and say, Hey, you know, I work here now. Can you expedite these? Like I want to be able to communicate with people like yourself and say did I understand? Like I have my own. I'm waiting on the Tyler hero autograph since 2019 like I get it and so if I can help you out, I will now obviously I'm in marketing. I'm not in customers. 

To. So I have a small amount of pole over there, but but I'm not, I don't want to put myself in the front of the line. Like, I want to be there with the people. I'm going to be there with my fellow collectors and and I want to be as honest as possible with you guys. And I also want to speak your language and just get people excited about things that excite me. Let me take a quick break, but we'll be right back with more with Jeff. What the athletes? We admire the sports card shop is changing the game. We're not launching threes bombing drives or hitting dingers, but we have built a unique Gathering Spot for all collectors to trade cards, talk sports, play games and watch their favorite athletes on the big screens. Yes, we've partnered with panini Upper Deck, Leif Topps, Fanatics, Pokemon and others, to bring you all the latest in sealed wax and singles, but the sports card shop in New Buffalo, Michigan is much much more. 

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8:51 PM
In everything we're doing for you the sports card shop, Connecting People Sports and the hobby around the world. We're back with more with Jeff. Yeah, I got to ask you this. It's like, you know, now would you be there? Me how many people message you? Hey, with that? Like I'm waiting on this redemption or does that could connect him? And Alice as it happened? Not happen, is it is. And I, you know, if I'm being honest, it is a typhoon of direct messages and just random messages for, you know, people, whether it's whether they 

Want to work out like a partnership or they just want free product or they want me to find their youngness redemption in. You know what I again. I empathize with these people, I get it. Like I was in that position up until two months ago, and I'm still in that position in some respect. So I don't while it can be a lot and there's only so much I can do. I don't blame people for reaching out to me and I want I want to be a guy where you feel comfortable reaching out to to ask a question about ping me or about the latest release. We've had or whatever it might be and if I can't if I can't do something about it and hopefully I can direct you to the person that. Yeah, I mean if people got to realize to like you're one person, he kind of just started. Like that's, you know, you know, I'm super new. I have to have to hit that like, I am I green here. I'm still learning. I am almost under 

Trying to figure everything out. Yeah, so don't. Don't put you. At least not yet. Give me give me give me. You're too. So we have to remember Tracy and been here almost 12 years. I have a long way to go. Go be at the level. He was with the relationships, he has. And that guy is that he's a lifer working on, you know, the business side of the hobby. So I'm I'm just a collector who, you know, luckily, you know ended up in this position. So I'm still trying to figure out the business aspect of this hobby of ours, though. You mentioned Tracy, hit the Heckler. I mean anyone that's been in the house before for length of time knows what he's done and what he represents. 

Like you said, this is the position. He left the recommended yet. Here. You are at me, talk about, you know, is that daunting or to fill those kind of shoes? Even you know, even though you know fairly well, you know, he's been on your show. I mean, talk about sort of that debt, sort of transition without a doubt. It is daunting. I even told people that I work with here, like I don't understand how one human being was. Possible for that much. And was that prolific with content, creation, social media, and the blog and videos, and the volume alone. The Tracy was able to produce is like, I'll be lucky if I ever ramp up to that level, but he, I mean, he knows this hobby inside out. So he's that, he had a major advantage. 

After having been here for 11 and a half years compared to myself. So I have to also be realistic about what I expect for myself. Like I'm a perfectionist and I want to immediately be like killing it but there's a lot to learn and I want to do things the right way and I don't want to, I don't want to you know, make a lot of shortcuts and so I'm just trying to stay realistic and humble about all this. This and eventually, hopefully I'll be able to do the position Justice. Well, like I said, they got a great guy and yourself. I'm not just saying that. I know you say that from, you know, no one what you're about. And, you know, they might be big shoes. But the big persons coming in there that the filament. I think they may, you know, I don't know who else interview and it would all your no respect to them. They got a great guy. Thank you. Be fun to watch. 

You know, more experience under your belt, but like, content stuff, man. You were to me, one of the, one of the, you know, at the top of that list. You've got even with backe speaking a Paki guy got to ask. I mean, where you will, we say, I know it's been about a year since any content is. Can you do it if you wanted to? And if that's the case, may we see packing sometime down the great question and thank 

You were asking about that kiyah kiyah. I don't know. It'll probably be a while just because we're, you know, we do a show Community called going direct Scott, purusa, and I do show, you know, Tracy we're doing it and what there is very Pat geek element to that. It's kind of our unravel portion of the show where we break some new products, and we're in a really unique position. Here. Obviously, we're getting products before most everyone, if not before everyone. And so, we have an opportunity. 

Open some of those products on camera before it's out. And for other people are cracking it. So that's pretty fun. I wasn't in a position like that if a key, but, you know, if I did do package again, and I'm not saying I won't ever, I would probably Focus continue focusing on the older stuff, not do any new stuff because there might be a slight conflict of interest by reviewing new releases. Well, well being here. Yeah. I mean wouldn't bother me here. I think we both can be loved, you know, look for the little thing and four times making a mountain out of a molehill. Now, I'm going to ask you, I'm not an mft guy. I'm old. I'm old school of the old man on the porch. I'm I'm you know, I can't hold it in my hand candid to you like physically. Like I'm it's not my thing and of teas are huge thing. I would see. Now being a premier me. What's kind of your, you know, even like as your head. I don't know what your opinion was before, like, you went to Panini, but it has that like kind of the dichotomy of that. Are you in NFP guy? Are you learning to be one? You know, where do you fall in projector? Yeah, why. I'm having to learn to be an mft guy. I'm a physical Trading Card guy through. 

I mean, frankly identities were going to, I thought that was a fad that was going to go away and obviously they haven't Panini has embraced that. It's a it's a big deal over here. So I'm I'm learning about it. What I was prior to being it, maybe was a crypto guy. So I'm interested in blockchain and I'm interested in the smart contract aspect of n of T. And I think that is really interesting and special. 

So from that standpoint, like I love the idea of an artist being able to MIT and of teas and add like, you know, five percent fee on to that particular work of art, and they get paid 5% every time. It changes hands, like something like that is highly interesting. Especially because, like II was an artist as an actor, and a writer for a long time, and a lot of my friends were making beautiful art work. And They they were having a hard time monetizing it. So I think I'm taking this on a tangent here but bacteria, I am learning a lot about in ft's and it's interesting. I'm having to kind of grasp onto the aspects that I find interesting and eventually, I will probably look at it as more of a collectible. And so yes, I am learning a ton about an ft's every day. Yeah, you know some of these and I Don't Preach to the choir here, you know, there's this 

An evolving Niche to it as literally as we speak. We're seeing a lot now with entities that have a tangible aspect to of whether it be an experience, or I do get something that I can Embrace more than just sort of, you know, a picture or digital video or put something that's, you know, aligned with it. It is physical to in nature. Whether that be a, you get to go to the game or meet this particular artist or play. A or whatever, you know, we could be a variety of different things that I sort of like because then they're dead, then it becomes a little bit of a physical element to it. Whether it be an experience where then you can take photos of your experience and made us part of that. And so that part and that's what if I'm looking forward, you know, speaking personally. That's the kind of entities that would pique my interest rather than just pure here's a picture. I own this digital copy, you know all 

Love this, you know, so that's, that's, I'm glad it's kind of, it's evolving into those sort of things because I'm more that, that it's all about me, but just speaking from, you know, I'm more open to that or septum to those sort of things rather than just. Hey, here's a digital thing. I owe. You know what I really think about that same John. I think I know I'm grasping onto the does. It was more tangible assets associated. 

And we got a, you know. And I know, you know, and I know I said that to remind myself to the Moog and I forget things, but you know, this is the early stages of this. This is a pretty new, you know, where cars have been around hundreds, you know, over 100 years ahead of T. This is a very generic infancy stages. So things are going to change they're going to evolve most likely and hopefully get better as well to sell it. And it's, you know, it's like the jury is still out Stuart. Early to really well, I may say it's not my thing, but it's actually a very palpable to just be sort of tunnel vision. Say, well, I don't like no one else, you know, I don't do that. Just say they can only speak for myself. And again, I always use it. You know, the old man on the baguette. 

That will be the game to space. I think rather than just have it, you know, only like a digital copy or video and you know, the internet's that outdoor invented, you know, so and to take another quick break to hear from another one of our great sponsors, but we'll be right back after that. When Morris cards wants to buy your car's, a long trusted name in the sports card. Business. Greg has been buying sports card collections for over a decade now. Now, any sport, baseball basketball, football hockey and any error, but did your Mountain will do just know jump. Wax error says, please to learn more and to celebrate, more should cards. Go to www.deewr.gov.au/rjcp cars.com fill out the Consignment sale request form, and someone will get back to you on how to get cash for your car. Also, if you're a dealer looking to sell your collection, Greg North wants to talk plenty of dealers, use Greg Morris, Mass. 

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Mojave to get more bang for your buck. Sports coordination is back with more with Jeff. You know, I'm curious just for being in the hobby. So long, like yourself. Just what? You know, and we've seen that in the last. Just I just think about the last couple years how the hobby is changed. You know, I talked about it on this show Jeff. You know, I'm old where you going to want to wait for the hobby for a year or two came back in that if the ground running and I miss anything, you can't do that for a couple days and your time. Thank you. Go on a vacation for a couple. 

Days, and you don't do anything card while you're gonna come back have to play catch-up but new Cycles or who knows what it's just a different Hobby and it's exciting too. Because for an old guy like myself and it keeps me hobby young. You know what I mean? You have no these years. What is dog years? Like seven? Yeah, seven seven, seven years or something. I'm getting that mix of a man. We need card here. So it's like, you know, two or three days equals a year of normal life. Yeah, that's what it actually is. Every once in a while. We get two or three days worth, sort of quiet will do the average in the mean. They're just put it as a week equals. What a Car, gear usually like many moons ago, but I know I talked to you is you off the area, if you know, the 

Always something that's kind of a regular thing. Or for you. It's become a regular thing for me. You're going to be in Atlanta City. As you said that before we went live here this is it going to be? Is it going to be different? You think it's going to be a different experience. Now with the you know the job you're doing the world. You have no doubt. No doubt. I mean I will be answering questions versus asking a bunch of questions, so there will be it will 

I'm very different than my last. My last National, you know, the last National I went to was the one in Chicago and I was out there with Eric Norton from Beckett and we were we spend a lot of time at the back of it. So in that respect, it will be similar because I was probably be spending the majority of my time in The Panini area. But yeah, I'll probably not be. I don't know. You know what, I don't know. It's gonna be my first with panini so I don't want To make too many assumptions before I got there but I can assure you. It will be very different than any of my past trips to the National. Yeah. Well, yeah, I'm look forward to be fun seeing you in that role too. And maybe I'll just pepper you with a bunch of come up to the booth and just be Barbara Walters, you know, just how cool yet, but even the last few years. 

You know. Now what what do you think like, I mean, it's crazy where the Hobbies gone, just with new Innovations, the Landscapes obviously changed, and now and iíll, write the name image and likeness. That's a that's a game changer to, I mean, just some of your thoughts, you know, even just separate from the Nene, just as a hobbyist. Like, just for, you know, the last few years all the curves like, know, what goes through your mind. I-i'm not somebody that runs away from change and evolution. I love that. And I think I want to say the hobby for a long time was so slow to evolve. And finally we had another kind of Renaissance where you see a ton of evolution in a short amount of time. Thanks. Things are starting to Trend mainstream with, you know, our beloved hobby that was 

For us collectors for the longest time and now we're seeing people that are interested in for different reasons, whether that's you know for an investing standpoint or if they are kind of a hybrid collector investor or their their content creators. Or whatever it is, you know, there's always been a little something for everybody in the hobby. But I think even more so now than ever in the past there is it's way more Dynamic and I love just the amount of hobby media that's being created these days. When I when I first started packing 2009 2010, there were many shows it was there and maybe a handful of people that are actually filming anything having to do with sports cards. 

And I mean, like, I'm laughing because I'm taking you in. Even through a shit card show and Italy cameras all over the place. I feel like especially with a bigger show Dallas, you know, we're at or obviously the national. I almost feel like, you know, every corner I turn. There's a tripod. I was being like like an extra walking like like crash in the scene like a movie, but that mean it like you said, from just in a few and even with this show, I started this in 2018. It was five for five. 

It's inflamed and that and that's just audio. If we get into the YouTube side of things. There's thousand mean, it is the walk, you know, the beach is packed, as I could, and I like to say it's. Johana it seemed to happen. You know. Quickly. Do you think, you know, speaking of that your you your contact great you think there can be an Overkill? Do you think that's the risk that, you know, like, you know, won't you can only watch so many. Videos. And listen so much audio. You can only listen to One audio package. You'll watch 33 TV screens are more but audio-wise you can only have one podcast out of time. You think we're we might get, you know, too saturated in those those areas I do and that that's maybe one of the more hypocritical statements. I've made a while, but I do think there can be too much content out there, you know, at a certain point and I talked about this a lot when I want to take a break from shooting pack. 

That I felt like I was just a part of the noise and I wasn't doing something that the hobby necessarily needed and I wish more people thought about that. Like what are some blind spots in Hobby content that that you could hear your content towards whether that's, you know, comedy would be great. My buddy. Matt Coleman does a show called the pole and he does comedy really well, kind of Like the office style, sort of sarcastic, dry humor. It doesn't incredibly well, but I think there's there's room for that. There's Roots. I honestly think there's room for scripted hobby content. It would be fun, like, kind of sketch comedy, but I think where we might not be going in the right direction. Is let's say myself and for my closest collector friends all have a show and we're in the same city and we go to all the same. 

Those together. Why not? Why not like merge and combine forces there and just make one great show with your buddies. I think there's some room for consolidation and I don't know that. That's what I would like to see is a lot of a lot of it like content creators run in the same circles. So why not want to make a show together, you know, make it that much stronger that much easier to promote because there's multiple people doing it, but you just I don't know if that's I do think To get back to your question. I do think at a certain point, not everybody needs to have a show, you know, it's almost like, you know. The transaction May because I'm a dealer as well and I still set up at shows like yeah, I've lived that and seen that for a long time. It doesn't it's fun when it's happening in, you're doing it directly. But for me to watch like an hour of that like not with all due respect, I was not going to do it. It makes me uncomfortable when I'm at shows, just minding my own business and somebody has got a camera on me like talking to a dealer or something. And when this is pretty pre-thought through 

I love doing stuff like this and I don't mind doing it. If it's if it's, you know, already set up an intended but something feels weird. When you're just mind your own business and all the sudden you're in the middle of someone show like that, that feels like you're, you know, you're may be overstepping your bounds there and I do, you know, not every show, you know, there's been a few shows that have like, said, I we don't really want cameras. So we don't want to, you know, we want to keep the experience kind of clean for the collectors and hobbyists. They are coming in the show. I know, the one here I went to the National. That there was almost as many cameras as as tables, you know, amazing, like every everywhere you turn, you know, you always you know, when people are taking photos. You don't want to get in the shot. It was almost like you were doing that. Weird video cameras rather always in the way. Yeah, like, you know, put Tiki, I mean, at the same time, he want to enjoy yourself and then check out as table. I think that's why you've seen some promoters say listen, you know, I rather we do that. I get it. It's fun, but You know, but it's a point, you know, a lot of the, you know, he's I just don't like seeing like the deal, you know, maybe because I am a dealer, but again, you know, it is seeing a 40,000 dollar Card, Exchange hands and that transaction. Not common and exciting to see, I guess the song, I mean even for me that's kind of cool. But you know you how many times can you see that? It's remain. Sort of interesting. Even if the card itself is different. It's a transaction of the hobby. I like 

Conversations more than even the the transaction itself just made hundreds, maybe, you know, maybe even the bartering, or how the deal gets consummate love to some degree, but after a while, even as I've seen this more, right, you know, it's like, I'm I'm old. So I can watch a movie about seven, eight years after I've actually watch it. And it almost feels like the first time but like two weeks after I remember it's different, but you know what? It's Again, that's the beauty of content creation to tell, you know, this is freedom of expression. Do you know if that's what you love to do? I know you won't not I'm not going to be one to say, hey don't want that. Not my style. So I'm just ice just I'm not going to probably partake in it or watch it and all of it and some of it you know, what you did even when packing you talk about a comical element. I thought you did a great job with some of the on some stuff in sound bites and 

9:14 PM
Maybe we'll, we'll see that. Again. Like you said, you do that the show there where you're bringing that element to that, as well as at that. So we're not totally devoid of you. Just got a little if you really, really are a glutton for punishment and you need some tacky. Can your life check out Panini's podcast going direct? We do it once a week. Loaded on Fridays. All right, time to take a break here, from one of our great sponsors, but soon we'll be right back with more. Or Jeff Pastime Marketplace has a line of grated guard cases that are waterproof airtight dust tight and hardened to protect and organize your valuable collection. Each of our cases come with pre-cut and preformed foam. So you don't have to cut you tear the phone. When you get your case, the pre-cut foam inserts are sized to hold KSA, Beckett SGC and CGS slabs. Store it all safely and securely with a case from Pastime Marketplace. Check them out at 

. Pastime Marketplace.com and we are back with more with Jeff just stuff. Your dad's Evergreen. So people can go to your channel and still while I mean, I've done that and just watch the old the old up was at you've done, there's still, you know, a lot of its vintage packed anyway, so it's it doesn't change. It's not a you know, just because you know, your watch it in 2022, and it's a 1970 types back. I can I find that more interesting is, you know, you don't see that all the time so you can still make, you can still get your, you still can get your fill a back especially if you haven't seen it. So there's a plug for you there. You know, you mentioned, you know, cut your acting, you know, you come from the actor, director writer side. We've seen like Ivan love grid comes from from that world as well. We've seen Rob go. 

The Mickey Mantle 5.2. We've seen a lot of it seems like or more. So I mean you guys have been in a long time with you and I when he grabs a little bit he's been on the show, but we're seeing a lot from that world to this hobby with. Why do you think that is? Is there a reason? Or you just think it's it's just is what it is. Gosh. I don't connection would be unless it is something to do with people that are dreamers kind of always looking. For a new adventure. I don't know. I mean, that's a strict. That's why I always lie. I don't know. I don't know that there's a connection but yeah, I don't know. I do think it's probably has something to do with kind of that Aid or age range because a lot of us in that age, range grew up collecting cards. So yeah, I don't know. That's a great question and we're seeing more, I don't, you know, I know I mentioned you, Ivan and Robin, I don't want to make it sound like that's it. I just ripped the three that came right off the bat we're seeing 

Borat, you know people in the acting Space Music, Space, just celebrities and general pseudo-celebrity and that sort of thing especially the last few years. I did with the hobby boom or you know, it's it made mainstream news. I said, I'm a show, you know, the local news here, you know, reached out to me and King my house and did a piece and mean just it's just me. 

It's, it's more mainstream than it's ever been. It's always been mainstream to us, but it's really gone. Almost God. We can say God Hollywood, right? Yes, you know, I didn't do that on purpose either, but it's really because, you know, 

Pull those out and been in storage or whatever. Sometimes I have to be the bearer of bad bad news about about that. But, you know, I also trying to be educational, explain to why. And, you know, not be harsh about it either. Like, hey, here's what I've got, plenty that do feel bad, you know, but that's kind of just a buzz around the Hobbies, got a lot of people who are, you know, quite a lot of new people in and she mentioned earlier. 

People who've had stuff and just kind of put it away, whether it be a closet. Roger and it says, hey, let's see if I have any hidden gems. They're kind of a treasure hunt of stuff that they already have. And it's just and I think that's why we're seeing some people come from, you know, again years ago. Like you said R8 it wasn't as cool to say to someone. Like, yeah, I collect sport, you know, so you do, it was sort of, you know, will not looked upon as finely as it is. Now that was like, the anything to do with that, you know, I I choked Josh. Lewbert did his Manifesto. They already said, trading cards are cool. Again. I did a spoof of it and I said, hey, trading cards of always just a little poke, a little poke the bear, but to me, it has, I know you feel the same way, but there is an element, you know, I know what, you know, thinking about it, and not react in this fast. I kind of understand what he meant. Like, you're getting a lot of new people who wouldn't have considered collecting or purchasing cars. 

So, that's kind of what you're driving at. I mean, it's just grown exponentially. I mean, you think you think there's, I mean, obviously, that's a good thing. When you're in the hobby. You want your hobby to be doing well and thriving, you think? There's is there an element where, you know, there's a, there's a bad side to that to, you know, how do you feel about that? And, and is that something you can bring to your roll up in Nene and say, I think about this here? I know there are 

Collectors amongst us that are not excited about new people, entering the Hobby. And I'm not, I'm not one of those people, like I've never looked at the hobby. Like this is, this is my hobby and like you are a part of it or you want you don't deserve to be a part of my hobby. I've never thought of it that way. I called my my personal opinion is always been. I would love to see this go more mainstream essentially to me that just means more of my friends collect. And talk about it. Like I love that and it's not some sort of because of any sort of financial reason. I just I love the idea that sports cards are embraced amongst pop culture. I think that's it. That's important and it hasn't been that way since you know, the Boom in the early 90s, we all know how that ended up. So let's hope this is a different trajectory, but I think it's good and certainly from and I'm just speaking there from a collector standpoint certainly from a 

Email marketing standpoint. It's wonderful. It's just growing our audience and we're happy to introduce new people or reintroduce new people into the Hobby. And hopefully they'll embrace our products that we like so much and hope they feel the same way. So yeah, I don't really see any drawback in it, goes back to what we were talking about earlier. There's something for everyone in the hobby. As long as you have that mentality. I don't think any sort of growth will Are you because it's just everybody goes off in their own Direction. They figure out what their places in the Hobby and what sort of what brings them. Joy in our Hobby. And that's all it is man. It's still at the end of the day. It's a hobby. Yeah, that's an outlet. It's something you enjoy doing to kind of get away from some of the mundane parts of rug of regular life. If you will, you know, yes, I've always said on this show Jeff the, you know, musicians that sort of their Outlet enjoy whether they're singing. 

Guitar drums or whatever instrument, you know, whatever your thing is that you supposed to be fun. I'm like you I welcome new people. I was a new person a long long time ago. Sure. And I was welcomed as a young kid. And so I sort of try to reciprocate that pay it forward. I may not like, I think I don't want to speak for him here too, but not may not like everything everyone does, but long as it's legal and above board. That's Their choice, the hobbyhorse their way and it doesn't. And that's the that's the beauty hobby. I think you kind of just said that is there's many different ways to do it and just pick one. You're passionate about and feel good about and not so much worried about, you know, what the person that she is always doing, you know, is enough of that in regular life stuff. Exactly. Did bring that element the hobby. That I've always said that, you know, we've heard the kind of Tatian. 

In it for for the dollar signs. And therefore, you know, those transactions that those those people who have been labeled as such that's important to keep an IV going for. You may not like it may not be your thing. You may not do it. But it's all part of the big part of the Hobby. And again, you don't have to do it. I don't have to do it, but I still welcome those folks and I like to be there if they ask any questions and that sort of thing, but you know, there are people 

There's an element that, you know, the get off my I was here first, you're not, you know, you're not a true hobbyist or the leg. You know, I'm glad I could do a whole show on that and I could, let's go down that rabbit hole. I know, you know what I'm talking about, and I just, I know you're like that. I tried to be like that. We're like, hey, enjoy the hobby, long as you're not doing anything bad to anybody or legal, that he's another real quick break, but we'll be right back after that. Iron sports cards is your number one source for all your PSA and other grading submissions, their Elite status improves, turnaround times. Heck they even provide the card Savers, their chat rooms provide updates on all your submissions. They also offer wax options and single cards to cover, all the bases. Check them out on Facebook, at iron sports cards group, or on the web at iron sports cards.com, or even give them a call at 1-877-560-4440. Sa Rob's, got you covered sports card nation is bad. 

We've seen the hobby. Grow a I don't think that's a bad thing. I think, you know you talked about that that 90s period, right. That was from