Card Mensches E25 "Coping with Hobby Burnout"

SPEAKER 1: Hey, everyone. John Newman here. Thank you for downloading this episode of Card Mens myself and Danny Black of Hobby News Daily would like to remind you this is a live show every other Friday at 9 p.m. Eastern.

SPEAKER 1: It can be found on most of our social medias. Danny's at Sports Ball and Hobby News Daily. I am Sports Car Nation Podcast and it can be found on our YouTube channels, at Hobby News Daily, Sports Car Nation Podcast at Sports Ball and at card matches.

SPEAKER 1: So with that being said, we hope to see you very soon on a Friday night in our very active chat room. Now, let's start the show.

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SPEAKER 3: Hey, I'm Danny Black and I'm John Newman. Welcome to Car Mats.

SPEAKER 4: Well, hello, I am Danny Black and that, that is John Newman and I don't know what episode number we're at, but it's been a whole long time. And how are you doing, my friend?

SPEAKER 3: Good episode 25. Whenever I hear that intro, I realize how on point we got that synchronized and welcome to card matches. It took a few takes. But, come out all right in the, in the end.

SPEAKER 4: I, think you're lying. We got an, the first take.

SPEAKER 3: I would like to think we did, but I'm pretty sure we didn't.

SPEAKER 4: What's up, Reuben? Feel the burn out? Yes, I definitely am not feeling the burn. This is not a, this is not a gym day. That's not what this episode is about.

SPEAKER 4: What's going on? The, the good doctor. How you doing Steven?

SPEAKER 3: How are you?

SPEAKER 4: Yeah.

SPEAKER 4: So we're, we're talking tonight about, coping with hobby burnout. So, we're, I guess we're sort of assuming that there is hobby burnout. And I guess we want to talk about that a little bit and then if there is hobby burnout, how to deal with it, you know, some of you may have noticed that I, you know, have a new razor and I've learned that my razor guards are different on this razor.

SPEAKER 4: That was something new. So, we're gonna give you tips of things to do when you have hobby burnout. Mine was learning that not to use this guard again.

SPEAKER 4: Yeah.

SPEAKER 3: And, and, and, you know, for me and, and for you and for other people that do content. Right. That can be a double edged sword. Right. It can be hobby burnout on the car collecting side or hobby side and in content creation. And, you know, I, I don't get, I don't, it's very rare for me. I'm not saying it's never happened.

SPEAKER 3: But I think it's rare for me because of things. I sort of do self-care wise. Danny, like preemptively already to avoid sort of falling into that, that pratt fall. So, not only I'm gonna probably talk about some things kind of to do ahead of time. So you don't even get into the, that hobby burnout, territory.

SPEAKER 3: And, and if you do, like, what do you do? Like, what are the, you know, what's the cure for hobby burnout and, and it, you know, it might be different for different people and, and anyone, listening or watching, you know, by, by all means, there's always that the, the chats interactive, what do you guys do and, and ladies do that, if you get to that point, right.

SPEAKER 3: So, maybe a good start is, you know, how, how do we define hobby burnout? How would, I mean, what do you in your mind, Danny. What do you call hobby burnout as a content creator?

SPEAKER 4: I think it's like writer's block. You know, we're, we're, we're, it just nothing seems fresh. You don't feel like you're, you're contributing good content to, to, to excite people, as a collector. You know, when I don't wanna play with my cards, that, that's not fun.

SPEAKER 4: You know, I, I, at, at heart love picking up any one of my cards and just, you know, and looking at it and reading it and, you know, whatever it may be. And if I don't have that urge and, you know, it's just sort of my card room and I walk by it for a day or two and don't go in, I don't know, kind of bums me out. I feel like I'm missing something.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah.

SPEAKER 3: I mean, I, it, it's happened so infrequently for me and I'm not trying to be like, bragging about that, but for, for me, hobby burnout is, it's probably only happened a time or two is when I just kind of look at what I'm doing card wise and say, what am I doing here or, you know, what, what's the, the end game or what's the long game and, and, you know, or I'm just not really feeling it, right now, but like I said, and I'm being honest, I really don't get hobby burnout.

SPEAKER 3: But that's because I really do things again, preemptively to really avoid falling in that, that pothole, where maybe others don't and then they get into that rut where they're unhappy. Right. Or they're not enjoying and, and that's probably, you know, I might have the way I describe my habit might not be entirely accurate but you're just not enjoying it anymore, or at least temporarily, or in the moment.

SPEAKER 4: Can I speak for you as your friend? Yeah. I think there are times where all of us are more excited and less excited about the content side and the card side maybe only for a day. But we, we all, we all, we all get that burn out a little bit every so often.

SPEAKER 3: I think for me it's what you just said. I think for me it's more about what, what's going on in the, the grand scheme of the hobby than internally with my own personal collection. I never say, oh, man, I'm getting rid of all these cards and I'm out, you know what I mean?

SPEAKER 3: But I will say, man, that's another bad story or another bad look for the hobby. Like this is terrible, not depressed. But that, that will, that will make me like a little bit down on what's going on. Like current events. I love what.

SPEAKER 4: What Mookie says here. It's also seasonal, summer's over. Baseball's over, the leaves are falling. You need to use your hobby budget when holiday gifts. The hobby will rise again. This two show pass. Sunrise, sunset. Oh, Mookie. Th this is one of my favorite comments of all time.

SPEAKER 3: Great.

SPEAKER 3: Well, yeah, I mean, I wanna went through a wall, like, if this was a football coach at halftime, let's go out there and get them, you know. But it's true. Right.

SPEAKER 3: We, we just, we just came from a point in the hobby where you had all four major sports playing at the same time. Hockey, football, baseball and basketball. And now we're, now we don't with baseball season, ending.

SPEAKER 3: And, some people who are diehard baseball collectors or fans, this is, could be depression mode for them. Because there is no baseball for another 140 something days until pitchers and catchers report. So I, I can see that.

SPEAKER 3: You know, I mean, I, I'll ask you, Danny, what, what you, you're willing to share. Right. I mean, this hobby burn out a thing to you.

SPEAKER 4: 100% and you, and speaking of almost selling everything and throwing it out the window and walking away, I, I came close to there, recently. So, yeah. No, I, I, you know, burnout for me is not giving up on the hobby, for long periods of time, but we all have periods of time where we feel like we want to give up on the hobby, you know.

SPEAKER 4: Iiiii, I get frustrated sometimes when I love cards. I think more than other people do. And I know that sounds selfish but it frustrates when I feel like people are trying to take advantage, or, or do something that's bad for the hobby.

SPEAKER 4: And it, it can get frustrating and it can, if you can feel helpless, you know, when you deal with these giant companies and, and, you know, or all the projects, you know, we deal with, with content creation and, you know, sometimes listen, we, we all say enough is enough sometimes and we have other things in our lives and, you know, we turn to those and, you know, I know you go play pickleball. But, you know, I, I have, I.

SPEAKER 3: Well, I think that's, you know, where I think hobby burnout happens, Danny and I, I'm not, I'm not trying to be a jerk when I say this. I think sometimes hobby burnout happens to people when they're consumed by the hobby. When it really just over takes and becomes the main focus of your life.

SPEAKER 3: Listen, I've been in a hobby since seven years old. I'm about to be 51 here in, in a couple of weeks and so 44 years, you know, probably once or twice. I was really, really, really frustrated in, in those 44 years. But the reason being, I think that I've avoided maybe more so than others is there weekends?

SPEAKER 3: This ain't one of them, but there are weekends where I don't even do anything content related or card related. I don't touch cards. I don't record anything. I don't watch anyone else's stuff. I just kind of take a weekend and do whatever else and, and it's not hobby related but during the week. Right. I do other things.

SPEAKER 4: But isn't that like your own way of, kind of like avoiding the burnout? That would happen?

SPEAKER 3: It is avoiding the burnout. So, I may not even be the best guy to tell you how to get out of hobby burn now because I don't get into it cause I just won't allow myself to, right? Like, by not being consumed and doing so many other things and, and with my regular job and, and extracurricular activities, softball, pickleball and, and other stuff, I'm, I'm forgetting to even mention, you appreciate it.

SPEAKER 3: When, when you're not doing it all the time, when you do something too much, it becomes monotonous. It could get, you know, old hat and, and I think that's where the Pratt Falls of, of hobby burnout. Come in. Same thing with contact creation.

SPEAKER 3: I had a little contact creation burn out. And in the e you know, where, sports Car Nations in the two fifties. But I, I've said this on the show around episode forties to the fifties of the show. I was really just, I, I didn't know all the shortcuts and I was taking a lot of time editing and the show was becoming a very time consuming and I'm like, I was enjoying it, but I wasn't enjoying it.

SPEAKER 3: And what I had to learn there, Danny is, how do I spend, how do I still produce the show at a, at what I perceive at a, at a decent production value, but not spend four hours on an episode, right? Or, or six hours on an episode.

SPEAKER 3: And I figured that out and, and kind of got back out of that sort of content creation burnout. And to the point, you know, I've talked about this, I, I think we've even talk, you know, I, I remember, you know, I i it did sometimes you don't even know it until someone else pointed it out. I came down I this, I'm a upstairs, this is where the office is in the studio is.

SPEAKER 3: I came down one night and my wife said, oh, nice to see you John, you know, sarcastically. And I'm like, what are you talking about? And she gave me to say, hey, like you're doing this podcast and like, I hardly see anymore, you know, and I'm like, she's right cause I'm just, you know, I sometimes it takes someone else to say it for you to finally say, yeah, you know, there's, let's figure this out.

SPEAKER 3: And so, you know, I watched a 20 minute tutorial video on how to edit and then, and the editor I was using, which is audacity and it saved me like three hours just that video, watching that video and, and learning stuff I wasn't doing.

SPEAKER 3: You know, but going back to the hobby side, I don't wanna make this a content creator type thing cause you know, but going back to the hobby side, I just take time away from the hobby. You know, I, I, someone asked me, I, I do those Q and A and I'll get off, I'll get off my soapbox here in a second. You know, I do those Q and A episodes and hobby quick hits. And someone asked me, John, how much time do you spend on a hobby?

SPEAKER 3: Combined that's doing, collecting, handling your cards, shipping orders, doing contact creation. And so I kind of did an average and it averaged out to be about an hour to an hour and a half a day. And so when you do an hour and a half, 90 minutes out of a 24 hour day, I believe that's around 8%. So, the hobby is about 8% of my life. So that means there's 92% of other things besides the hobby for, for me.

SPEAKER 3: But I think for other people, Danny. Like again, I don't wanna paint with a broad brush but I think for other people, that number is higher than my 8% and, and in some cases, probably very significantly higher. 2535 40%. And I think when you get into those higher percentages, you better love it. You better if you're doing something 35 40% of your, your day, you better love it.

SPEAKER 3: You know, when, think about that eight, if you work an eight hour job, that's 33% of a day. Right. That's, that's so if that soap is melting. Yeah. You know, so, you know, you get into the 40% or you're working eight hours and coming home and spending four or five hours with cards or content that's half your day gone.

SPEAKER 3: And if you're not a single person and you're married and you got kids. God bless you. I don't know how you're pulling that feet off. Honestly. I've said if my show is tw, my son's 23 years old, if he was a younger kid, w which he was at one point, but I wasn't doing content at that point.

SPEAKER 3: You know, I don't know if I could do what I do today, if I had a, a young kid or kids. So, it's, it's the balance of your time. Right.

SPEAKER 3: And I think when, when you spend too much time and not just hobby that's gonna be applied to, to anything you can get, you know, burnt out, your job can burn you out if you're number one, if you don't enjoy it and you're working 12 to 14 hours a day. It's something you don't enjoy. So, I think, you know, it's the old cliche line. Right.

SPEAKER 3: Absence makes the heart grow fonder. I just don't get consumed by this.

SPEAKER 3: And by now not getting consumed by it, I, I enjoy it. And I, that's how I think I avoid that hobby. Burnout if you will. But we're seeing a lot of people talk about it.

SPEAKER 3: You've shared your person that you, you had it recently. So it's a, it's a real thing whether, whether I don't get it or you don't get, it doesn't mean, it, it doesn't exist and, and it's, it's something we, we talk about, you know, I love you.

SPEAKER 4: So, I'm gonna take your advice. So I'm only gonna talk 8% of this show.

SPEAKER 3: I know I went out that was one of my soapbox rants. But, but, you know.

SPEAKER 4: No, I wanna catch up on this. I agree with everything you said, you know, it, you know, I love you and, and, you know, that I agree with you. So, you're, I want to catch up because, Mookie says with everything going on in the world, the hobby remains such a valuable refuge for me.

SPEAKER 4: I'm so glad to have chats like this on a Friday night after a tough week. Mensches help avoid the Real World burnout. Mookie, I gotta tell you I could have written them and, and felt the same way.

SPEAKER 4: That's why I'm here. Iii I, I've had a really shitty couple weeks.

SPEAKER 4: Th th th this has been, this, this is a refuge for us too and, and I think that's one of the ways to get over the burnout, is to enjoy it. Make sure you're doing what you enjoy. I mean, I'm lucky enough that I look forward to doing the show no matter what is going on.

SPEAKER 4: Unless the Savannah Bananas are in town and then, you know, that, that changes everything I do. I look forward to doing this show and, and, and, and, and to me that, that allows me to use the hobby as to flip the hobby. And that would be one of my tips, flip the hobby around and make it a positive. If, if, if, if doing too much content for me is a negative. Well, then let me flip it around.

SPEAKER 4: Let me make sure that the content I do. I'm enjoying and, and, and, and, and, and change my perspective on it instead of me having just to do show after show, let me take the next show and make sure that I'm having a freaking blast doing it and, and the hobby works in your favor, as a collector because I don't want to make it all about, being content creators.

SPEAKER 4: I changed and, and, you know, this, the way I collected, over the last year or so in, in a lot of ways I, I started more set collecting or PS, a registry collecting and, and I've become more of a slave to, to, to the registry. But I, I've enjoyed it and, and I've had a blast and, and I, after all these years have learned, you know, that it's ok to change the way you collect. It can be fun.

SPEAKER 3: That's a big one, new thing. Yeah, that's one of my mantras. Right. If you're not enjoying the hobby, don't be afraid to pivot. Right. Hey, I don't like one of my, that's.

SPEAKER 4: What I just said. It, it's so, it's mine.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah. Well, it's, everybody's right. You know, I'm, I'm not the first one to say. I want to put a comment here from Brendan up because this is a great point too. I, I agree with this when the hobby is booming. You never hear about burnout.

SPEAKER 3: Right. Maybe it's a natural correction in perspective. Yeah. The hobbies calm down. Right. Prices have come down. Some people, you know, aren't making hand out money, hand over fist. Like, was once the case two years ago, a year and a half ago.

SPEAKER 3: But it is what it is. I'm a guy that kind of rolls with the t, listen, I'm doing a show tomorrow, as a deal I've had to get out my price gun and lower a bunch of stuff. I do. Am I jumping up and down for joy. For having to do that. No, but that's, that's come, that's part of the territory. Right.

SPEAKER 3: Just the same, you know, when I can buy something off somebody that will cost me a lot less as well. So, it's a, you know, it's a two way street. So, you know, you just got to sort of, a adapt your, again to your point too. Right. You can come at the hobby with a different angle. Hey, I'm gonna collect, you know, soccer.

SPEAKER 3: I've been thinking about doing it. I just haven't taken the plunge. Now I'm gonna do it right. Non sports, whatever, whatever the thing is. Hey, I'm gonna, you know, start collecting graded cards. It's not something I normally do, but I'm, I'm gonna do that. Well, I'm not gonna do graded cars anymore.

SPEAKER 4: Iii I did my, I did my first real set collecting in 30 years.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah. And see, I used to be a set. I used to be a set guy. Now, I'm not, I don't have the room. So you kind of adapt to your environment. You know, when I had more room I had more sets. I have less room. I sold a lot of my sets and now I just collect more individual cards, you know.

SPEAKER 3: I've narrowed, here's the other thing. You can still be in a hobby and narrow your collection down. And I think that's something I've done. Like, my personal collection is immensely smaller. Than my show inventory. I don't need, I don't need to.

SPEAKER 4: Hear about the size of your collection. Steven says, you, you lower your prices. John, most of the local shows I've been to still have 2020 one prices.

SPEAKER 3: Well, and, and, and that's why you see the same cards in the showcase. Right? I mean, I don't have to lower my prices but, if you want, yeah, I mean, am I your museum or am I a dealer when I set up at a show? Right.

SPEAKER 3: And again, I'm not telling dealers what to do. That's their cards. They can price it any, any way they want. I'm, I'll be the first to tell you, there's some cards that I, I know are over comps in, in, in my cases, probably a couple, I just not really in the rush to sell them and, you know, I just wanna have them out there.

SPEAKER 3: I don't do that too often or I try not to, but I mean, I'm not, I'm, I'm a very honest guy. I know that can be the case, on a couple of things and, you know, but again, that's the dealers, right? They gotta, they're traveling to a show.

SPEAKER 3: You know, they gotta, they gotta decide like, hey, do I wanna sell a bunch of stuff and, and make this trip worthwhile or do I wanna just show off my cards and, and have a bunch of people that, oh, that's a cool card, you know, and then walk away. So, I, I, to each, to each your own but you gotta, you gotta adjust to the market if you're, to me, if you're a dealer, you know.

SPEAKER 3: And it just part, you know, and cycling stuff's gonna go up again too and it's just timing, timing can be everything, in the hobby when it comes to buying, and sampling. So, you know, but there's another thing Danny that I do is again what I said, right. Take time away. Sometimes. Just hit pause. You know, I, I'm getting out of hobby.

SPEAKER 3: I'm not enjoying it. Well, rather than get out. Why don't you just pause, keep what you got go away, you know, don't do anything hobby wise for a week, two weeks, three weeks, a month and then see how you feel that sometimes that's all you need is just sort of, a step away, you know? And, I'm sorry, BB.

SPEAKER 4: Brendan Ryan is cracking me up.

SPEAKER 4: I've always taken the hobby, at leisure too much of a good thing and all. And then he says, tempering our passions with, with, with the rock on symbol. There is nothing more, more sexy than tempering our passions, brother and I'm with you.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah.

SPEAKER 3: You know, II, I listen, every once in a while I've talked about this too. So, someone who listened to the show has probably heard this before but I get messages sometimes. Hey, John, love the show that I'm really down on the hobby. It's a point of frustration for me.

SPEAKER 3: I'm thinking about getting out and it would be really easy for me to email back and say, yeah, get out. Let me buy all your cards and, and be that guy. Right. But I, I obviously don't, I just try to get some of the, you know, my response is usually why don't you just take a couple of weeks away from that and see if you still feel that same way. Right.

SPEAKER 3: It's the old, when someone wants to quit their job. Right. I'm quitting and you hear a bo, a boss or supervisor, like, you know, go home, think of, you know, take tonight and think about it. You still feel that way. Let me know tomorrow. Right. It's that sort of thing. The hobby version of that. Right.

SPEAKER 3: Instead of one night they'll take a little more time and then if you still don't care or you took two weeks off of not doing anything hobby related and you didn't miss it and you still don't like it, then maybe there's your answer. Right. It's time to exit, stage, stage left.

SPEAKER 3: But I just, I think sometimes we don't realize, like, how consuming the hobby can be. You know, you're, you're, you're, you're handling cards your own, you're buying cards, you're selling cards, you gotta ship, you're listening to content, you're making content maybe. And, you know, you're putting in four or 56 hours a day of doing all that stuff combined and you're like, holy smokes.

SPEAKER 3: It's midnight, you know, and I gotta be up at six in the morning. You know, that's where I think how you can, you know, get caught in that hobby. Burnout trap. You know. And, but it's like anything else too when you're at a lower threshold too, with, with prices come settling down and things not being at the crescendo, you're gonna get more hobby burnout at, at, at those times.

SPEAKER 3: Like Brandon Ryan, said, some comments back. I think that's just, that's the nature of, of the, yeah. You know, you know, maybe just spending too much time on, in the hobby and there is a thing that is a real thing.

SPEAKER 4: Mark Coyle, has dropped and how are you doing, Mark, late to the party? What's going on?

SPEAKER 3: I like, the Mookie with the George, Costanza.

SPEAKER 3: I remember that episode.

SPEAKER 4: I want, I want, I wanted to bring it up because I'm gonna give you a chance to laugh at me, laugh at me and I'll make fun of myself. I was working in baseball when the George Costanza episodes of him working for the Yankees happened to air.

SPEAKER 4: You've seen me in person, let's just say a lot of people called me, George Costanza.

SPEAKER 3: Well, maybe for other reasons. But, you know, but I did, I don't, you know. But, so that iii, I mean, what, what I, I've, I've kind of gave my sort of, you know, tips, take a break, take a hobby vacation if you will.

SPEAKER 3: I mean, what, you know, what other than walking away, which is probably the, the, the, the, the low hanging fruit of how to, you know, get out of hobby, burn out or avoid it. What else could you? And, and, you know, do you have anything else you can do?

SPEAKER 4: I, I serenity now, can I be honest? I rely on my hobby, friends. I, I think it's important to make friends in the hobby just for those reasons. You know, I can talk to you. I can talk to other people and I can say, listen, I'm, you know, I'm just having a tough one and you'll tell me ok, whatever.

SPEAKER 4: So, I'm looking at this Ichiro that I just found online and all of a sudden I'll get a smile on my face when we're talking cards again and I'll get reinvigorated, you know.

SPEAKER 3: It's no, that's a good point. But it's also good to have friends in the hobby. And obviously we're, we're on that page that you can talk, not hobby with too. Well.

SPEAKER 4: They call John John, they just call those friends.

SPEAKER 3: We're just friends. Yeah. But that's what I mean. That's what I mean, sometimes, you know, when you, when you've talked so much hobby that I just want to talk to someone, even if they're in the hobby. Like me, I don't wanna talk to them about hobby stuff. I wanna talk to him about life stuff or what's going on in your neck of the woods and that sort of thing.

SPEAKER 3: Because you, you kind of, you know, over saturated, with hobby that you want to sort of break from that. So, I think the best hobby friends are the ones you can talk, not only hobby but like, hey, daddy, I don't really wanna talk hobby. Let's talk sport. So let's talk whatever else. Totally different.

SPEAKER 4: Now, when we don't talk, when we don't talk cards, we go way off the reservation and talk sports.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah. But sports is different. I know there's a correlation that way. There are. I'm kidding. I'm kidding. Yeah. But, I mean, it's still non hobby, right? We're not talking about cardboard or chrome or slabs and, and that sort of thing.

SPEAKER 3: And so sometimes it's ok to just say, hey, man, I love you but I don't wanna talk hobby today. I wanna talk, this is on my mind or this is going on, in my life. Right? And sometimes it's life itself that can cause hobby burnout. Right.

SPEAKER 3: You know, you see people maybe get in financial trouble or a big bill comes and they're like, hey, I've got to sell my whole collection, you know, and to pay a big expense that came out. I don't know if that would qualify as hobby burnout per se. But, well, how about to me.

SPEAKER 4: Life gets aggravating. I mean, you know, I'm, I was dealing with this insurance situation forever. It just wore me down. I, it was hard to get excited to open.

SPEAKER 3: Up a pack of cars and I know, I know someone said it in, in the chatter. Right. The hobby is supposed to be an outlet, right? For, to get away from the every day m mundanes of life. Right. For my dad who, who does have a car collection, but he doesn't actively collect. He's a drummer in three bands at 85 years old.

SPEAKER 3: That's his outlet. Right? And I, I, you know, I talked to him, I'm like dad, you know, you're 85 you got, you had some health stuff come up recently. You sure you wanna like drum that much? And he's like John, this is, this is what I enjoy doing. It's my outlet. You know, and if something got happens when I'm doing it, at least, I'm going out enjoying what I do.

SPEAKER 3: Right. And so, you know, I, I guess if you would, you know, you do whatever you, that is enjoyment for you. But if it gets to a point where you're doing it too much and for my dad, and in this example, playing with three bands is not too much. Maybe if he played in 1/4 band at 85 years old it would be, that would be the tipping point.

SPEAKER 3: Right. So, sometimes I think it's the tipping. It's the scales. Right. I'm just doing a little too much. And that's where the hobby burnout kinda, comes in. So, you, and that's everyone, that's an individual decision. There's no, just because I, for me it's 60 to 90 minutes a day.

SPEAKER 3: A norm or a good, a good point for someone else might be three hours. Right. For someone else might say an hour and a half j, I don't wanna spend 30 45 minutes a day and, and, you know, so it, it's every, it's up to the individual to decide what, what their schedule can allow withhold and, and still be enjoyable, form.

SPEAKER 4: Warren says life definitely gets in the way of times. We were in a difficult time. But when I come down to my man cave card room, I am at peace.

SPEAKER 4: Yeah. And what, even, w wife is starting to get it now, I built her a lady cave. Well, I hope you didn't put your cards in there too because that might be.

SPEAKER 3: She said, but she called, I thought they called them. She sheds.

SPEAKER 3: I saw a commercial where it was a, she shed. But I guess if it's in the house it's a, it's, I was about to say if, if I, if I, if it's a separate building it's a she shed.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah, it's funny. Now, I really, why makes me feel really guilty.

SPEAKER 3: You know, because my, my wife, Sharon said, man, you got all your stuff all over the place. Like, I don't have a review.

SPEAKER 3: You do? I don't have a, so I do kind now I'm feeling sort of guilty.

SPEAKER 4: Here, let's, let's talk about this for a second. You guys both have real hobby, responsibility. It's a little different for you all.

SPEAKER 4: We, we, we have different hobby, responsibility. I mean, we, we have regular content schedules. We have, you know, listen, I have Hobby News Daily. You know, for me it's more, I, I do rely on the hobby more, for, for my finances in life.

SPEAKER 4: But the burnout is, I think is different than what we're talking, you know, the burnout is, I don't know. Maybe that may, maybe that is a good point, you know, like, like you said, you know, not being able to escape it, and having it be a refuge is what we want it to be. So, if it can't be. Yeah, that, that, that, that, that, that, that could put me into burnout.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah. I've, I've said with cat creation, you know, I think that's what he's talking about with the responsibility. Like I enjoy doing. I enjoy, I don't know.

SPEAKER 3: I probably should be feeling guilty but I didn't do nothing wrong. It's just that I, you know, it's not like I took over this room. She said I could, like you're married John.

SPEAKER 4: You did something wrong.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah, that's true. Yeah, you're right. All right. That better to just, you.

SPEAKER 4: Wake up every morning and just apologize. And that way Da Dad.

SPEAKER 3: Ruben came up with, we got names now for the, the, the lady Man Cave Dame dead. She said she, she try saying that 10 times for, you know, with, with happy responsibility.

SPEAKER 3: I don't know, I don't feel like, you know, and I know people that, you know, I don't feel like I'm in, I'm, well, I know I'm not any better than, than anyone else, like with the shows, I enjoy doing the shows. You know, that's how I know when it will be time to hang up the microphone, so to speak.

SPEAKER 3: If we do this show and I'm going through the motions or not laughing or having fun if I'm doing sports carnation and I'm interviewing a guest for an upcoming episode. And, you know, I'm gonna talk to him at s at 7 p.m. and it's 3 p.m. and I'm like, I really don't wanna do this interview or conversation later. That's when I know like you're done.

SPEAKER 3: It hasn't happened, you know, knock on glass. So, but I've always said I don't have nothing to do with a demographics. Report or downloads that I get. It'll be when I just don't feel like I'm enjoying it or having fun or bringing and, and so, if that day ever arrives then I'll know, you know, it's time to, to not do that, anymore.

SPEAKER 3: You know, and even that, maybe, even with that, maybe take a break rather than just announcing, hey, this is the last episode of this, hey, we're just gonna take a, a hiatus. It's like a band, right? Like rock bands, right.

SPEAKER 3: We're not breaking up. We're just taking a hiatus. We're, we're like, hate each other right now. So, we're gonna take a hiatus and maybe after a year of that we'll, we'll like each other again and we'll go on the road and, and tour again.

SPEAKER 3: Well, you can do that, you know, hobby wise. You can do that content wise, as well too. And sometimes that's what you need is a break. Sometimes it's, hey, I don't need to get rid of all my stuff and get out of the hobby.

SPEAKER 3: I just, I just need to take a month and not even think about the hobby or content creation or whatever, you know, insert whatever activity, I, in, you know, in there and, sometimes that break is, is all you need and, you know, for others they, you know, I've had someone tell me, like, I, I don't like to have me anymore.

SPEAKER 3: I'm out like I, I, I've had someone say, I heard, I heard your, your diatribe on taking a break. I'm not even gonna do that because I know it won't make a difference. So I'm, I'm getting out, I guess you gotta know yourself, you know.

SPEAKER 3: But there's a lot of different things you can do even besides the break, collect a different way, sell a portion. Sometimes I think we get, I don't wanna say our collections get stale but when you see kind of your, your PC and maybe you're seeing the same things and it doesn't move your meter in the same way.

SPEAKER 3: Well, you know what if that happens, if that happens to you sell some of that stuff that don't move your me doesn't move your meter anymore and buy stuff that's on your list that will, you know, replenish that, that PC or refreshing GC. I if you will.

SPEAKER 4: John, you're speaking from years of experience, you had a card shop. You, you without a doubt, I know had burned out at a time in your life.

SPEAKER 3: Well, I said with the card store, you know, I had the card store when in the nineties, when ebay came along and I had the card store, I was 24 years old when 90. No, I was 22 when I started the card store. But you know, you're 22 and your friends are asking you, hey, we're going here Hey, we're doing this road trip.

SPEAKER 3: You in Newman? And I'm have to keep telling them like, no, I gotta open the store. I can't, I can't make that trip. I want to, but I can't, and ebay kind of came along and you post, you know, you list some stuff on ebay and, and you're getting, you know, notifications, like, hey, I'm selling cards at 3 a.m., and you're like, you know, I can, I can still enjoy the hobby and do things.

SPEAKER 3: What a young 20 something year old guy, wants to do. And so that's, you know, I did the card store from 92 to 97 and then it was time to, I don't, I, I don't wanna say I burn out from the card store that's too strong, but there was definitely, like, it was time for me to go in a different direction.

SPEAKER 3: So, if you wanna call it a mild case of burnout, I wouldn't argue with that, but it was just time to do, traveling. I did some, some shows, Pennsylvania, Ohio, Massachusetts, Connecticut.

SPEAKER 3: And I kind of just didn't have to be in a card store every day at a certain time and, and kind of locked in there.

SPEAKER 3: You know, and I wouldn't trade that experience. I'm not, sorry, I had a card store from 9297 but when I left in 97, left the store, not the hobby.

SPEAKER 3: It was time for me to go because I think, had I not left and just kind of played the string out. That's where I think that the burnout would have definitely really set in and I might have just got so mad or frustrated. I, maybe I would have sold all my cards, not done shows and just, you know, exit stage left. So sometimes just knowing when, when is, is huge and sometimes you do and sometimes you don't say when John, when Jan.

SPEAKER 4: I think that a couple of people have made the comment that burnout is tied to the the quality of the market, whether prices are up, sales are up and you know, the market's hot.

SPEAKER 4: And that, that creates enthusiasm, then when prices go down or the markets that, that you, you get the, the, the burnout or you know what, whatever that feeling and emotion is and I think there can be some truth to that.

SPEAKER 4: I think nobody likes losing money and you don't have to be a flipper to not want to lose money. I'm I'm a collector, I've got plenty of things back there that are personal collections. I still don't want to see them go down by 80%. You know, it doesn't mean I'm selling them, but I don't want to see.

SPEAKER 3: Buy more, buy, buy more or buy stuff. If you're a seller or reseller, you don't even have to be a flipper buy stuff that you think, like, yeah, it's down now, but it's gonna get off the mat, it's gonna get off the mat eventually. I don't wanna.

SPEAKER 4: Mention everything, but, you know what I've done in the last couple of months I've, I think I've taken advantage of a soft market.

SPEAKER 4: And I agree with you there, but that's, that's kept me going, so I don't burn out in a slow market. I've almost had to do that to keep to, you know.

SPEAKER 4: And I love this. Mark we were talking.

SPEAKER 3: About, it's a great comment. I was just, I'm glad you put it up from, from Mark. You're not here.

SPEAKER 4: Mark says he some nights I'm up in my room for an hour or two other times. I'm not up there for a couple of days.

SPEAKER 3: That's me, that's me there. You know, there's some, I don't, you know, we, we almost talk not every day but almost, like the, like this, you know, I'm texting is one thing but I'm talking but there's sometimes we, I just don't get up here for whatever reason. I just cra like sometimes I'll just crash at 89 o'clock and I'm tired, I'm like, I'm going to bed.

SPEAKER 3: You know.

SPEAKER 3: So I, what Mark said is, is he read my mind cause there's just times I just don't do, you know, and that's where that hour and a half I came up with, figures in the play. So, if I don't, if I didn't spend any time, let's say today, but I spend three hours tomorrow on average, there's an hour and a half.

SPEAKER 3: So there are days where that, there, that number is zero and there are other days where that number is three or four and that's where that, that 90 minutes a day average comes in and there's nothing wrong to me. There's nothing wrong with that. Right.

SPEAKER 3: And, you know, when, when you have a family, and, and this, I'll be strong about right. Your family has got to, to come first. I, I talked about this on Sports Car Nation. I had a dealer friend of mine that was just so consumed with the hobby in doing shows every weekend. And I remember he came, we used to set up together at the shows that we did and he would do a lot more shows than I would, which is where the problem.

SPEAKER 3: And I remember we were set up next to each other. We were talking, I don't even think the doors are open. He goes, me and my wife really, you know, had it out the other day. I, she's, I'm saying I'm doing too many shows. I'm on the road too much. I'm not home.

SPEAKER 3: I got small kids, but I love this stuff and he wanted me, he wanted me to, like, take his side and basically say your wife's wrong you keep doing shows and, and do what you enjoy and, and I didn't tell him that I don't think you necessarily like that, but I was very honest, like you gotta, you know, decide what you, you know, your, your marriage being a dad with your kids.

SPEAKER 3: You know, s kind of step back and, and listen to what your wife might be saying.

SPEAKER 3: I don't think he liked it. He didn't change what he's doing in a couple of months later, we're set up at another show and he's like I got served papers and this sucks. What do you say? What could I say? Right? Like, you know, oh man, that stinks. I'm, I'm sorry, you know, but I've seen it cause I've seen being consumed by something cause the war any more.

SPEAKER 4: Do you have any more? Pick me up stories there?

SPEAKER 3: Here's another one, I'll make it quicker, you know, I play a lot of competitive in my younger days. I played even more competitive softball, but I had a teammate. Same thing. Thanks. It was just softball. Instead of hobby. He was traveling, doing tournaments and playing four nights a week in regular leagues that traveling on weekends.

SPEAKER 3: And, and I remember I was at a tournament with him and he's like, yeah, I'm missing my daughter's dance recital. I was, I know I'm missing my son's little league game. And I just remember saying to myself like this is a recipe for disaster. And sure enough, you know, his wife, they, they got divorced and he's paying, you know, child support and, up, up the ying yang. So anything can be.

SPEAKER 3: And I think hobby burnout sometimes comes from, again, being consumed. But that can happen whether it's playing a, a sport or darts or softball or being a dealer and you're just away from home to a point where your wife or, or a spouse says it's too much. I'm, I'm, I'm here on my own drowning while, while you're kinda having fun and I'm picking up the slack. Right.

SPEAKER 3: That, those are real scenarios. I've seen them, I've heard them, firsthand. So you have to, you have to know when to say when I guess and, and, and sometimes I think that's even, maybe sooner than you want to, or maybe you have to spend less time than you even want to.

SPEAKER 3: But it's just healthier for all, all involved. Right. I, I had another, you know, I had a friend of mine whose son played video games, like, 15 hours a day and he was venting to me. Hey, hey, John, there's Jordan. That's my son. Does, he play 15 hours a day?

SPEAKER 3: I'm like, he plays a couple hours a day on his Playstation because I can't get my son, like, he's like, addicted and it just, it can cause problems. So, you know, it's, it's, I think the time you spend is what causes burnout. So if you're feeling it, you know, move that lower, that time spent and then kind of re evaluate where you are.

SPEAKER 4: Repeat that one more time. I'm sorry, I wasn't paying attention.

SPEAKER 3: Well, I hopefully everyone else is cause I'm not, I'm kidding.

SPEAKER 3: But you know, I don't know. And again that whatever that is, it, it could be different things for, for different people. Right.

SPEAKER 3: You know, so, you know, I, I'm blessed with a wife who's supportive and, and, you know, but I've cut down on, I don't play as much softball as the younger version of me did.

SPEAKER 3: I, I don't do as much traveling show wise as the younger version of me did.

SPEAKER 3: That's more my decision than my wife even saying like, hey, knock it off, that's more me. Like, I don't want to be at a show every weekend. Some of my funnest weekends are where I don't even have plans, Danny. I've had this conversation with you where I can just like, do whatever, stay home and, and watch football, or have no itineraries, read, read, read this comment.

SPEAKER 4: I saved it for you because I think I think that you and I both will like, we both like this.

SPEAKER 3: Hey, guys spent the evening with my three year old granddaughter. Great way to avoid hobby burner. Awesome. From Stokes, right.

SPEAKER 3: You know, you can travel without being hobby, you know, I, I always get this. Hey, John, I'm, I'm, I'm in the hobby. I know you're in Syracuse. I'm traveling to Syracuse. What card store should I check out? Right. Or I'm going, you know, and that's great. And that's, there's nothing wrong with that. I'm not saying otherwise.

SPEAKER 3: But, so I, when I go on vacation I'm not really, you know, I probably don't go on a vacation often enough and now that I think about it, but when I do, I honestly not thinking about card stores or, or checking out a card store, it's not that high on my list. I'm on, you know, I'm on vacation. I'm, I'm more of a foodie. What restaurant are we gonna go to on Friday? Where are we eating on Saturday?

SPEAKER 3: That sort of thing, you know.

SPEAKER 3: But that's me. I, I, you know, and that's just how I compartmentalize, you know, my hobby and, and really the vacation is sort of my vacation. Not just away from the hobby but your job and every day you compartmentalize.

SPEAKER 4: Much better than most people. You're just not aware of it. I've gotten better, but here's the thing, most people, most people aren't, don't do it as well as I've got.

SPEAKER 3: Well, listen, I, I'll, I'll confess I gotten better at it in the older I've gotten the, the, the younger version of me wasn't as good as at it. No wonder. No wonder. You're so good at it. Well, you get older and you have to cut down on some things. Right. It's, it's, it's like everything, right. Everything in moderation, everything from food, salt, sugar, soda, coffee, a hobby. Right. Everything in moderation.

SPEAKER 4: I love this comment because we, I talked about it before.

SPEAKER 4: Drop board with cards. Now I'm collecting tickets, mix it up.

SPEAKER 3: Pivot, pivot and, and, and, and you can always, you know, you wanna come back to cards again that, that door, I it's closed now, but you can reopen it if you, if you so choose and you can open a new door as you did with, getting into, tickets, which, I did a, I did a quick hits on that. I think that market, is still got a lot of ceiling, left in it.

SPEAKER 3: So, you know, but, you know, you, you gotta know yourself and your limits and, and where that point of burnout is and sort of like making sure you don't kind of cross that line like Moonlight Gram and in, in field of dreams, right? Where you, where it gets, you can't go back or, or going back, is not fun.

SPEAKER 3: And so, you know, I, I've gotten better at it, like you said, Dana, I've gotten better at it. You know, I'm gonna be 51 here shortly. I've gotten better at it in my older age than 20 or 30 year old version of me was, was, you know, I think I'm better at it. I think what helped me and I don't, I don't wish I, I'm sorry.

SPEAKER 3: You know, but those stories I shared with my softball buddy who got divorced cause he playing so much softball or my dealer acquaintance that was doing way too many shows and his wife finally had enough. And I think those experiences, even though they weren't direct but indirect, those experience, I took lessons from them like, you know, note to self. Right. The old note to self, like, be careful here. The Pratt Falls.

SPEAKER 3: And, I think unfortunately at someone else's expense I've, I learned sort of what not to do. You know, I, my, my sister has four kids. She's older than me by 13 years old, they're all grown up now. So I was a young uncle. I knew, seeing my sister with four kids, I said at an early age, I don't know if I'm ever having kids, but I know this, I'm not having four. That's why I wouldn't.

SPEAKER 4: She live in a town without a CV S?

SPEAKER 3: She lived in a, I just, I just saw like, you know, I saw the sac and she was a great, she's a great mom. I'm not, but it was tough. Right? And I just, I said, man, I don't wanna have four kids. Can tell that's not sort of the lifestyle I want to, to, to, to sort of live.

SPEAKER 3: But, you know, some people, kids are great. Listen, I, I won't argue that point but I just, sometimes you see how other people, their experiences and it kind of shapes how you, your approach, right?

SPEAKER 3: And so from that dealer who got divorced, my softball buddy who got divorced, my sister having, four kids and me being a young uncle, those experience kind of like lay out sort of in, at least in my mind like what I do or don't want to do and I'm sure other people it's the same way.

SPEAKER 4: Brendan Ryan says, even in the post apocalyptic movie, the book of Eli Baseball cards had trade value.

SPEAKER 4: I mean fantastic.

SPEAKER 4: Ruben says kids are great, especially when they go back to their parents.

SPEAKER 4: We're gonna clarify, clarify that. You mean you're a grandparent, you're just not picking up kids randomly.

SPEAKER 3: The candy van, the white, the white van with the black spray paint candy. Yeah, I hope.

SPEAKER 4: Ruben's not Ruben.

SPEAKER 4: The kids are a blessing. I have three. Thank goodness they're all asleep right now.

SPEAKER 3: And listen, listen, I, when I told that story with my sister, I'm not trying. It wasn't in the negative text. I just, I just realized as you can, I couldn't do four.

SPEAKER 4: I think she's freaking nuts and I don't know her.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah, I be I became an undo. I was 11 years old. So there was times I'm like, I don't want any kids if this was what it's gonna be like. You know, I was a listen, I had to babysit my nieces and nephew, a lot as a younger, uncle. So I, I have my, that's wonderful.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah.

SPEAKER 3: So it's those experiences, right? That shape who we are and, and, and, and decisions, we make but even without them, right, we have to decide for ourselves what's, you know, another topic just kind of winding down here, Danny too. I know we talked about this off the air. We're seeing a lot more shows now, right?

SPEAKER 3: I'm doing a show tomorrow in Watertown, New York. It's the third one ever there, right? It's a brand new, show, small show.

SPEAKER 3: I'm usually a bigger show guy. So this will be a different setting for me. We're seeing a lot of new shows and locations that never had them. We're seeing, you did, you did a show in Pittsburgh where there was another show literally across the street at the same time. I seen that one before. Yeah. So we're seeing all these shows pop up and now the market is, is corrected.

SPEAKER 3: I, I, you know, sometimes I feel weird even saying the down market, I think the market has come down and, and corrected itself. But yet we have more shows. We may get to a point. Maybe we're there already. I, I'd be interested to see what the chat room, what, people watching or listening thing. Do you, do you think maybe we have too many shows? Is it oversaturated of shows? And that could be playing into burnout, as well?

SPEAKER 4: I don't know about you. I've also had card shops open up in my area recently. I've had card shops expand, and move into larger locations. So I wonder if these weren't plans that were made, you know, in the last year or two. And you know, now everybody's kind of got to execute their plan.

SPEAKER 4: E even though the market's not, not as strong and it seems a little awkward like you said, you know, in, in this environment to have this much and this blows me away. Look at, look at we have five shows in two weeks in the Minneapolis area. I mean, that's, that's a lot. This is ii I don't know, John is the junk junk show era.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah, we just Steven just coined in, you know, we got the junk wax error, we got the, the junk slab error. Now we got the junk show error. If you use that, make sure you give Dr Mayer the credit. I don't know if he stole it from someone else, but as the first I've heard that, so I'm gonna give him the him the credit there.

SPEAKER 3: Yes. It is actually the show that I'm doing near the salmon run mall and we're hoping, veterans get in free at this show. So, hopefully, we'll have some there, to enjoy the hobby and not have burnout. Speaking of that, it is Veterans Day.

SPEAKER 3: So, thank you to all who have, served in the past or were, or are currently serving, as well. We wouldn't get to enjoy, the freedoms of, of the hobby, without that. And so, shout out to all those, who served or are currently, serving. And, yeah, five, here's the other thing. We're going back to stoke's comment about five shows in two weeks.

SPEAKER 4: I'm gonna, I'm gonna step in real quick because, we're, we're not gonna have a show in two weeks if I don't, if I don't get this message in experience, quality, consistency and the quickest turnaround times in the grading industry, we are proud to partner with SGC grading.

SPEAKER 5: Check them out at WWW dot go SGC.com.

SPEAKER 4: And I'd like to add that. Getting cards graded is a great way to break your, a cycle. If you haven't. If you, if you need to mix it up a little bit, take some cards and get them graded. If you haven't done it and, and, and get them back, it'll get your juices flow.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah. It's like opening a pack. Right. That's the funnest thing in the hobby. Except when you look at your bank account and, you know, but, no grading. I'm a, you know, I'm, I'm biased but, you know, yeah, we gotta hire, I don't know, I don't know what we could pay him, but we gotta hire, we gotta hire Mookie.

SPEAKER 3: But, but going back to Stukes, comment, five shows in the same area in two weeks. Right. How is that? Not be? Because I venture a guess without knowing without being there that if you have five shows in the same general area in two weeks, what are you gonna have? Most likely you're gonna have a lot of the same dealers set up. Right.

SPEAKER 3: If I was doing the Syracuse show every week instead of every 2 to 3 months, like it is, you know, people, the consumers coming in would, would have burn out from seeing my ugly mug and, and the other dealer's ugly mugs. The same ones that frequently. Right. And I, it is, it is, I think we're at that point, we're at that point where it's, it's a legitimate discussion to have.

SPEAKER 3: Is there two men shows? It's one of the reasons when, you know, I don't know how you've, your take on it, but every once in a while we hear that rumor. Right. Let's, let's do two nationals a year. One on one in, Chicago and one on each coast in alternating years.

SPEAKER 3: I don't want two nationals. One of the, the beautiful things about the national is, is, it's one it's like Super Bowl Week, you get one super bowl y a year, right? I don't want two Super Bowls. I don't want a first half super bowl to say so that, you know, speaking of over saturation and, and we, we haven't had two national, I just know there's been a rumor that's come up here and there.

SPEAKER 3: But I think that, I think if the nationals went to 22 nationals a year, I think it takes the bloom off that rose and the mystique of, of, of that surrounds that show. I take, it takes that away a little bit. So I hope they don't do that.

SPEAKER 3: You know, even if it's in Chicago every year, whatever they decide, to do eventually, I think one national is good. But again, like Stokes 0.5 shows in two weeks in a general area. Like, it's just too much. Right. It's too much. And in my opinion, someone else would be like, you know, now I, I did all five of the shows and, and, you know, did very well. I, if there would have been a six show I would have signed up, for that.

SPEAKER 3: So, you know, yeah, one national. I, I hope the national ever goes to two shows. You know, I just, and I had, I had Ray Schulte on, on the show. He, he pined that. It's probably not gonna be the case. But, you know, sometimes that's what happens, right. So, things are good and then we want to do them too much and that's where that over saturation occurs. This is, this is your question, New York, the Strongsville guy.

SPEAKER 4: I've gone through the last three or four.

SPEAKER 4: Whatever it's been, I don't know yet is the short answer.

SPEAKER 4: Luck, luckily for me, I don't need to make that decision this far out.

SPEAKER 3: Well, if you come through, if you leave Baltimore and come through Syracuse on your way to Strongsville, pick me up and I'll chip in for gas and then I'll go as Yogi.

SPEAKER 4: Bear said, you know, when they told him he was, you know, lost when he was driving. He said, yep. But we're making good time.

SPEAKER 3: No, my favorite, my favorite Yogi Line is, no one ever goes there anymore. It's too busy. That's my favorite. Well, if you have.

SPEAKER 4: Not seen the bird documentary that's out now, it's worth watching. It's, it's out. I, I think on Netflix and, Amazon Prime.

SPEAKER 4: If you, I don't know if anybody in the comments has seen the, the Yogi Bear piece John. It was great. I know we're.

SPEAKER 3: In order to watch it. I know a lot of Yogi from being a New Yorker and that sort of thing, but I definitely haven't seen the, the have a hold of respect.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah, I wanna see, I, I, it'll be something I, I'll, I'll find and watch and in that. So, he was, he was classic just, and listen, he managed the Mets too. Not very well, but he did manage the Mets.

SPEAKER 4: Well, it was, they talk about that.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah, look, man, I'm late to the party here.

SPEAKER 4: Well, it's funny. So if people, if you guys are in the comments, and see if you agree with this, my son watches it and goes, Yogi Berra is the Bill Russell of baseball with all the rings. Yeah, you know, and, and you know, he's got, he's probably.

SPEAKER 3: A guy that doesn't get, you know, we're going in a different tangent. I think he's a guy that probably doesn't get enough credit for the career he had, he.

SPEAKER 4: Doesn't know we, we gotta watch this documentary. Ruben says it's on Amazon.

SPEAKER 3: Oh, I have that. That's all right. Maybe Sunday. I can't do it tomorrow. I'll be out of, like I said, I'll be out of town but I show but I think Sunday I got, what's it? Two hours?

SPEAKER 4: I think I got two hours planned on Sunday and on a separate note, 80 for Brady with the four ladies was fantastic.

SPEAKER 3: I saw that, I saw that movie. I'm not gonna lie about it. My wife was a good movie. I wanna say my wife made me watch it but she would request, you wanna watch it? We got like a free, and she had already seen it in the theaters with like some of her friends and she said she goes, John, I think you're gonna like this.

SPEAKER 3: I know it's not normally a movie you'd watch and I, I, I'll admit it was better than I thought it was gonna. No, I did not cry just for the record. I did not cry at 80 for Brady. I would say I did if I did, I cried.

SPEAKER 4: But, you know, Mookie says good call. Son of Danny Bill is to Yogi's height, but otherwise apt. Yes.

SPEAKER 4: Very funny.

SPEAKER 4: All right, John, we, we, we are, past our bedtime here.

SPEAKER 4: Any, anything else? You wanna add? We've done an hour five and I feel like I've done five of that.

SPEAKER 3: So, and, and, and I'll just say this, I, I'll say I'll just take, since we did the main topic of the show was hobby burnout. If you ever get to that point, you know, my door is always open.

SPEAKER 3: You know, my phone numbers. I like, I, I'm glad to talk to someone off the ledge per se and I've gotten those messages. Right. I've never tell people, like, get out of the ho, you know, I, I see a lot of people, oh, you don't enjoy the hobby and having fun.

SPEAKER 3: Get out, you know, I don't like to tell people to get out unless they've tried everything and they're just that unhappy then I would say that but I always try to give pointers or just take a break or, you know, sometimes just talking about maybe your hobby burnout, might, might get you past, you know, over that hump. If, if you will.

SPEAKER 3: So, my door is always open, for, for, you know, for anything but, with stuff like that and, and, you know, I'm not saying I'm an expert but I just have done things to sort of avoid that pratt fall. And, you know, sometimes just talk right. Sometimes getting stuff off your chest is a weight in itself and sometimes that's, that's what all you might need in, in certain situations.

SPEAKER 3: So my door is always open for, for things, especially like that and, you know, sometimes it's just taking a break, hitting pause, right? And then just didn't play again when you're ready to, to come back. And I mean, I took, I wasn't for burnout but there were four years when my son was very young that I hit cause I hit pause. I, I just kinda, my stuff was in the closet. I didn't buy any new cards.

SPEAKER 3: I didn't sell any cards and then I just kind of came back and, and, you know, opened it back up again. There's nothing wrong with doing that. That was a four year break. So, that's why when I do the math. And someone says, how long have you been in the hobby? I have to minus those four years. I actually didn't do anything.

SPEAKER 4: So, Mark with the last comment and I says I could go to a show every weekend in the Boston area. I go to one probably every three months. I still see the same stuff.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah. Yeah. That's the, that's the dilemma. Right. You get the, you see the same stuff in the show too. One thing I try to do, especially if I have some lower sales or I, I didn't move a, a lot of individual cards, you know, I'll just put stuff out at a, at a, at the same, you know, at the same location.

SPEAKER 3: Let's say if I'm there, if I was there the previous month I'll try to put some new stuff out. Just, just to refresh it. Right. I think some dealers do that or have that mindset. Some others probably just, you know, I always, I always get a kick out of the dealer who has, like, one showcase and, like, it holds 30 cards and they have 10 cards in there.

SPEAKER 3: I, like, I couldn't do that if I, if I tried, I actually think it would be. Just think how easy that it is. Right. And you, you load your card up, you throw, you load your car up, you throw one showcase and one box with 10 cards. The only thing funnier.

SPEAKER 4: Is, if you made it 10 base cards in top loaders.

SPEAKER 3: I know, usually when you see that set up, they're all four figure or higher cards, all you gotta do is sell one of those things and you show this kind of made. But, you know, I just, you know, I'm, I'm, I'm two tables and that's still, I could fill up more. I just, that's what I choose to, to rock with.

SPEAKER 4: It is, well, I just wanna piggy back real quick on what you said before about, you know, your, your, your door is always open. You're always willing to talk to people.

SPEAKER 4: You know, that, that, that I just wanna, you know, second that and echo, echo that sentiment.

SPEAKER 4: You know, I, if anybody ever wants to talk, if anybody ever, you know, is thinking about it, call John.

SPEAKER 3: Well, I'll make it a conference call and I'll pat you in. That's what you get for. I'm not any help. I'm not gonna do it and, and I'm not saying I'm an expert. That's not where, that's not what I meant by that, but sometimes like, you know, it's like any problem, right? If you kind of keep it internal, it sort of stews and can get the best of you, right.

SPEAKER 3: Sometimes just getting it off your chest, whatever it may be is all you need. Sometimes again, every scenario, every person is different, but for some folks, they just need to really discuss it, get a, get sort of an outside, you know, thought process or opinion and, and then they feel better or set them in, in a better place.

SPEAKER 3: And so if I can help in that regard, again, I'm not a clinical psychologist or I, I never call myself an expert than that, but I've just been doing this a while and, and experienced, I guess, you know, I'm experienced but not an expert. And my, again, my door is always open, not just for this, but just, just in general.

SPEAKER 3: That's just sort of my, my nature. It's kind of what I do even in my, my regular job with being a, a teaching assistant in, in the special education department. Right. You, you, you try to help people and, and, you know, sometimes you're better at it some days you're better at it than other ones. But, I, I always try when I can.

SPEAKER 4: Well, on that note, John, you got a beverage next to you.

SPEAKER 3: Yeah, it's not Coke though. It's, it's, it's black cherry soda, black cherry Cheers.

SPEAKER 4: And as they say hi to life, say good night, John.

SPEAKER 3: Good night, Jan.